St Kilda going home !!

[mr six o'clock]

Great for marketing.

Great for image.

Great for the players.

Great for footy fans in general (particularly interstate supporters staying in St Kilda Rd hotels).

Great for the St Kilda restaurant district.

Too many positives -- why hunt frantically for negatives?

Great for the local pushers

Great for the local hookers

Everybody wins

[Waltzing St Kilda]

What I do know is that i see plenty of Saints players at the cafe I go to in St Kilda which is 5 minutes to junction. jack, Geary, Dal, Goddard, Joey and plenty of others. Compared to Seaford where they might have to kill a couple of hours it would be much better. It might not be the main reason but it might add to their general satisfaction levels and make the place seem a little more 21st century and glamourous and make some of the bigger clubs look less enticing. It looks big time instead of back water.

And it's important. To compete realistically with GCS and GWS in a few years' time, not to mention all the other clubs with bigger cheque books, we're gonna need to keep our players so happy that they're willing to accept smaller contracts just to stay.

That means the environment is everything. Not saying it's impossible to manufacture such an atmosphere at Seaford, but it seems easier to do at St Kilda. Or Moorabbin.

[Enrico_Misso]

Gee people are making it sound like a done deal, and even sound like we might play there

My reading is that it will never be more than a training ground.
And there is an awful lot of water to pass under the bridge before this proposal gets off the ground.

Having said that, I would love to see us get some representation there.

It is our ultimate home.

We have played at 32 different grounds.
But at the Junction Oval we have played
- more than a quarter of our total VFL/AFL games
- more than double the number of games we played at Moorabbin
- more than triple the number of games we have played at the MCG

It was our original home, so would love to re-establish that connection.

[3rd generation saint]

What I do know is that i see plenty of Saints players at the cafe I go to in St Kilda which is 5 minutes to junction. jack, Geary, Dal, Goddard, Joey and plenty of others. Compared to Seaford where they might have to kill a couple of hours it would be much better. It might not be the main reason but it might add to their general satisfaction levels and make the place seem a little more 21st century and glamourous and make some of the bigger clubs look less enticing. It looks big time instead of back water.

And it's important. To compete realistically with GCS and GWS in a few years' time, not to mention all the other clubs with bigger cheque books, we're gonna need to keep our players so happy that they're willing to accept smaller contracts just to stay.

That means the environment is everything. Not saying it's impossible to manufacture such an atmosphere at Seaford, but it seems easier to do at St Kilda. Or Moorabbin.

So what if they have bigger cheque books, there is still a salary cap, you can only fit so many players in your club under the salary cap.
Carlton thought paying big money for a marque player would equal success (Judd) yet they haven't won a game yet and we look closer to a premiership than they do right now.
Maybe Essendon are thinking of opening up some nice cafes near Tullamarine.

[tony74]

The money men are starting to be interested.

[Jacks Back]

WE WOULD NOT BE GOING BACK TO THE JUNCTION OVAL

WE WOULD BE TRAINING (NOT PLAYING) ON AN OVAL NEAR THE JUNCTION OVAL

WE ARE, THEREFORE NOT GOING BACK TO ANY SPIRITUAL HOME AT ALL

I can't see the point.

[Dave McNamara]

Dodders is barking up the wrong tree. If Cricket Vic want government funding, they need another big sport. As Eastern pointed out, they need us.

Year round priority access(?) Sounds ominous, but in reality... cricketers can't play or train on the oval in winter. They'd have access whenever they wanted to any indoor facilities, like nets. And of course there'd be their admin there all the time... as would be ours, and the women's cricket admin.

Facilities like gym, pool, latte machines would be even better funded and more comprehensive if there were more than just male cricketers using them.

We could train over the road (under the tunnel) in the cricket season, then on the Junction Oval in the footy season. No reason why mutual cooperation between men's and women's cricket and the mighty Saints should not be very very mutually beneficial for all!

And hey, we support each other, and work for each other's mutual benefit. Win/win. And all the extra fans, sportspeople, players, press, sponsors, corporates that each of the other bodies would draw to the Junction Oval... if there's goodwill towards the Saintas, pretty damn good chance that via osmosis we can pick-up further support in all those categories. Gotta think of the potentials Saintas...!

So to all my fellow Saintsationalists who run the line of it doesn't matter where you train...
I say having a place to call home does matter,
I say a place to hold functions for fans and sponsors does matter,
and I say... the end game includes all the above and more, including... eventually playing games for premiership points! Oh yeah!

Big potential, exciting potential. Big picture, exciting picture.

Keep the faith!

[tony74]

The money men

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/s ... 6880389116

[bigred]

We were hounded out of the Junction Oval by cricket.

Now they want a co-tenant to help secure upgraded facilities.

Tony Dodemaide made it perfectly clear that cricket will retain overall control of the facilities.

Call me cynical, but I see history repeating itself as soon as it's convenient.

Not cynical at all. For that is what will happen. Could be quite a risk to be honest.

[Dave McNamara]

Junction Oval:

- No room to build.
- No funding.
- AFL doesn't want it.
- Cricket doesn't want it.
- Public access problems(!) (This is the most perplexing objection of all. As a Mate pointed out, what's the public transport and parking like at the Adelaide Oval...? And, so how do 250,000+ get to the Grand Prix... every year???)

Well, all of these impossible hurdles have now been shown to be... possible.

But then, everything's impossible till... it's possible.




Come on you sad sacks, watch this again, and start dancin'... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUbx6GxOhrM

How cool is that! This what we are all about. This is where we should be! We are St Kilda's own wonderful iconic Saintas footy club!





Come on sad sacks, keep bouncing off walls like Pluggs (above), keep dancin'. Happy in St Kilda!

Happy in St Kilda!

[BigMart]

What

We're going to be pretentious wankers?

[Dave McNamara]

What

We're going to be pretentious wankers?

What? Is this breaking news that you have Mart?

But why would we want to move to the Lexarse Centre?

[joffaboy]

This thread has all the hallmarks of the mob mentality that went feral when Mr Right and his mob of economic incompetents Football First, staged the coup against Rob Butters and hi admin.

Short sighted knee jerk from emotional supporters who want decisions made that will eventually cripple the club (as Mr Right and Football First have done financially)

Junction Oval will be as relevant to most supporters as Seaford. It may be more convenient for me as I can almost walk there from work, but really, what other beneifts?

None. CV get precedence (basically giving up the MCG for non international games) so we would be beholden to CV.

How big is the ground? What benefit is it.

And spare me the BS about players whinging about travel. Maybe if they dont want to travel 30 minutes to work, they dont want to play when the Saints are interstate, or Geelong either.

The elephant in the room is that Labor have committed to a 31 million upgrade to Ballarat Lake oval and if they get in Junction Oval redev wont take place anyway.

[Jacks Back]

Everyone seems to be going on about us returning to our spiritual home however, the way it looks to me, is that CV will be using the actual Junction Oval and we will be using the Harry Trott Oval nearby with a tunnel under the road to get there.

Yes, our training base will then be in St Kilda (which is all fine and good) but we won't actually be training on the Junction Oval all the time (maybe CV will be gracious enough to let us have a light run on there once a week or fortnight) in their off season but we could probably do that now.

And then there are the people on here that think we are actually going to play proper games there. WTF?

I don't get how nobody on here understands this?!?!?

[spert]

Right now, St Kilda FC is a brand and it needs to be be marketed in the most high-profile areas possible- in order to get the highest returns possible for both the club and the AFL. Like it or not, the money and power is in the inner suburban regions of any city and that's where you firmly plant your product, especially one with national media exposure. I have no doubt that we will be based at Junction Oval again in a partnership with the Victorian Cricket authorities, overseen by the government and AFL, once all the technicalities are ironed out amongst the interested parties.

Where the team trains is just a by-product of those decisions.

[magnifisaint]

Caro is starting the beat the drum loudly on this one. I wonder if this will be one of Finnis's pet projects!!
(Am I allowed Eastern?)

[thezelk]

Exactly spert, This will be a commercial decision, greater exposure! which will lead to greater benefits.

The club release amuses me though, where they state they only became aware of this recently, what constitutes recently, does last Nov apply?

[saintbrat]

Caro is starting the beat the drum loudly on this one. I wonder if this will be one of Finnis's pet projects!!
(Am I allowed Eastern?)

I wouldn't exactly say Seaford has been all bad-
and as far as flying the flag- how many are going to see it at harry Trott oval
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/st-kildas- ... zqt75.html

[The Fireman]

I can't understand the detractors in going to the Junction unless of course they live near Frankston (my sympathies if you do on so many levels)

The position of the Junction is high profile..the area is iconic , it's our club's true homeland.. we would be crazy not to consider basing ourselves there permanently.

[plugger66]

Right now, St Kilda FC is a brand and it needs to be be marketed in the most high-profile areas possible- in order to get the highest returns possible for both the club and the AFL. Like it or not, the money and power is in the inner suburban regions of any city and that's where you firmly plant your product, especially one with national media exposure. I have no doubt that we will be based at Junction Oval again in a partnership with the Victorian Cricket authorities, overseen by the government and AFL, once all the technicalities are ironed out amongst the interested parties.

Where the team trains is just a by-product of those decisions.

Dont get these comments at all. The hawks have become a huge club since they went to waverley. The pies are inner city but they were always huge. North and melbourne couldnt be much closer to inner city and they are bottom 4 clubs in size. essendon have moved from Essendon to even further out of the city. We wont get increased media exposure because we train at the Junction if we are a bottom side. if we are a top side we will get exposure wherever we train.Soponsors get their money from exposure on TV, Papers, radio etc but not because of the training venue.

[joffaboy]

All predicated on 10 m ill coming from the Fed Govt which has stated it wont cough up.

Dead in the water

[Pleasing]

Firstly let me declare I have always been of the opinion that a return to the Junction Oval was a pipe dream and that there would be too many obstacles to make it work; heritage restrictions, council restrictions, Grand Prix, Cricket Club, Local Residents, all the sporting clubs already using Albert Park and finally and most significantly the cost which for a struggling St Kilda already trying to sustain two training / admin sites was to my mind a good way to bankrupt the club.

Most of those issues are still relevant and probably why the clubs official response was so cautious. However there is potential opportunity here as well as risk and we quite rightly seem to be exploring that opportunity.

The first significant opportunity is that this would not be a St Kilda led proposal Cricket Victoria the State Govt and the AFL have the drivers seat and that means that some of the obstacles can be swept aside a little more easily. ie Planning restrictions council objections etc.

Second the cost aspect, there is a significant gain for the AFL in freeing up the MCG in March, this has an ongoing recurring commercial value to the AFL that makes a short term investment from them in support of the project sensible. Similarly I suspect the AFL is fully aware that burdening St Kilda with additional debt would be a pretty stupid thing to do as ultimately the AFL would end up having to bail us out anyway. I suspect the involvement of the "money men" Fox and Ryan etc. is a sign that any funding from St Kilda will be in the form of donations from wealthy supporters. Fox in particular I imagine has a pretty sentimental link to the Junction having played there and grown up across the road. To an extent I think this would be a token contribution to the project with the real money coming from a combo of Cricket, AFL and Government.

So I now think it is more than a pipe dream it is a real possibility.

My biggest concern now is how do we ensure that the partnership with Cricket Victoria and a shared use model is sustainable into the future. If you look at most shared use models they typically break down within a pretty short timeframe. Lexus Centre was supposed to be shared between Collingwood and the VIS but that lasted about as long as it took Eddie to decide he needed a bigger office. So the question we need to ask is, will the design of this centre be big enough to sustain the growing needs of Cricket Victoria and St Kilda into the future. I note that we have already apparently out grown Seaford.

Perhaps we need to be clever about this and really take the shared use model to the next level and consider the concept of shared services. What services can we merge with Cricket Victoria to reduce the cost to both organisations and get some synergy between the organisations. Fitness and Conditioning - Medical and Nutrition even Legal and Finance or Communications. Not sure this could really work but some form of mutual dependency or ongoing benefit needs to be established, or within a short space of time the immediate compromise of sharing the facility to raise the funds necessary to build it, will no longer be relevant and Cricket Victoria as the prime Lease holder will be looking to push us out of their facility so they can expand. This is the biggest risk I see in the proposal, it will need some careful planning beyond "how do we finance the build" for this to really work.

[spert]

Right now, St Kilda FC is a brand and it needs to be be marketed in the most high-profile areas possible- in order to get the highest returns possible for both the club and the AFL. Like it or not, the money and power is in the inner suburban regions of any city and that's where you firmly plant your product, especially one with national media exposure. I have no doubt that we will be based at Junction Oval again in a partnership with the Victorian Cricket authorities, overseen by the government and AFL, once all the technicalities are ironed out amongst the interested parties.

Where the team trains is just a by-product of those decisions.

Dont get these comments at all. The hawks have become a huge club since they went to waverley. The pies are inner city but they were always huge. North and melbourne couldnt be much closer to inner city and they are bottom 4 clubs in size. essendon have moved from Essendon to even further out of the city. We wont get increased media exposure because we train at the Junction if we are a bottom side. if we are a top side we will get exposure wherever we train.Soponsors get their money from exposure on TV, Papers, radio etc but not because of the training venue.

Well plugger66, you need to think outside the old Saints box mate!

[Eastern]

Caro is starting the beat the drum loudly on this one. I wonder if this will be one of Finnis's pet projects!!
(Am I allowed Eastern?)

Caro is beating the drum loudly BECAUSE her Richmond are part of the "Bully Boy Pact" that wants to get cricket off the MCG earlier !!

[Con Gorozidis]

Right now, St Kilda FC is a brand and it needs to be be marketed in the most high-profile areas possible- in order to get the highest returns possible for both the club and the AFL. Like it or not, the money and power is in the inner suburban regions of any city and that's where you firmly plant your product, especially one with national media exposure. I have no doubt that we will be based at Junction Oval again in a partnership with the Victorian Cricket authorities, overseen by the government and AFL, once all the technicalities are ironed out amongst the interested parties.

Where the team trains is just a by-product of those decisions.

Dont get these comments at all. The hawks have become a huge club since they went to waverley. The pies are inner city but they were always huge. North and melbourne couldnt be much closer to inner city and they are bottom 4 clubs in size. essendon have moved from Essendon to even further out of the city. We wont get increased media exposure because we train at the Junction if we are a bottom side. if we are a top side we will get exposure wherever we train.Soponsors get their money from exposure on TV, Papers, radio etc but not because of the training venue.

Well plugger66, you need to think outside the old Saints box mate!

Location is but one factor in many that determine success. its bloody hard to pinpoint correlation and causation in all of this.
I mean the hawks seriously got their s*** together in admin and their recruitment has been well ahead of the curve (Isaac Smith and Luke Breust anyone?). They have plucked players out of all parts of the country.

But Waverley is only 20km out and Tullamarine only 18km - both family areas.
Big diff to Seaford - 50km..

I mean who knows - With the explosion of apartment living in the cbd in the last 5 years - maybe the 'inner city' clubs (norf and demons) will make a comeback - but thats mainly the 20-40yos who probably already have teams locked in from their childhood - which means it wont help them.

So I think the key is the same as its always been - you need new kid fans getting on board.

So many of the hawks adult members now were kids in the 80s who got on board in that successful dermie/dunstall era - so i think that has contributed to what we are saying now in terms of members and dollars.