Billy Longer

[joffaboy]

Who are the 8.... Name them

McIntosh.... Ruck
Simpson..... Ruck
West.......... Ruck
Blicvas....... Ruck
Vardy......... Fwd Ruck

That's 5

They will like trade one out one IMO

Pods, Hawkins, Brown, Walker - ruck fwds

That makes 9.

Also Ryan Bathie…

But Mitch Brown I'll take back - NINE.

lol - Geelong must be in disarray

Longer - developing senior ruck
Hickey - developing senior ruck
Stanley - Fwd/Ruck developing
Pierce - long term VFL ruck developing
Holmes - speculator - not even in the developing mode as yet
Jolly - maybe a rookie as a backup, maybe not even on the list

Longer - 20
Hickey - 21
Stanley - 22?
Pierce? - 20 ish
Holmes - 23

How old was Mac when traded?

Any of the first 3 could go by the way of Mac in trades etc.

What is the problem?

[gringo]

The problem you have Gringo is looking through rose coloured glasses. its a good problem but makes it hard to really look at players ability. At the moment baring the old mids it is likely that Jack will be elite. There will be the Armo types in ability but there will also be the LJ conners types in ability. Maybe not as weak as he was but 3 or 4 on that list will never be mids of any note at all. names I will give you are Milera, Murdoch and saunders. They may make it elsewhere and I have pretty high hopes for saunders but not as mids. Even Wright and newnes may not end up as real mids. The only real mids on that list are Curren, Ross, Armo and Steven with Geary doing a tagging role if needed but again he is better elsewhere. We are 5 class mids short and that is why the 2 years is going to be very painful.

I think we need mids of quality but if you look back over the drafts a lot of the elite mids are taken between 8 and 25 in the draft. Ball and Judd were an exceptional pair of highly rated mids but using your number one to five pick on a mid can often bring a Bryce Gibbs, Scully, Trengove etc.

Fyfe was pick 20 something from memory in 2009. I think the only other close to elite mid from that year was Dusty and he went at 3 but still is a fair way from elite. I don't over rate all our players and I said we need some but you can keep getting them in and sending them out but you need to play the ones you rate.

To get 5 very high quality mids you need to get them in and develop them. They obviously think those above are worth trying to develop because they are being given every chance. I didn't say we don't need them I just said it's over stated. If Longer was taken he is not a bad recruiting decision because he isn't a mid fielder.

There are some very good mids that should slide to the late teen early twenties. Dumont, Dunstan, Hartung, Tsitas, Kennedy Harris etc.

You have no idea who will become elite out of the guys currently on our list. I think Armo will improve again and was starting to show some real dominance, Jack obviously made the biggest leap forward, Newnes has been earmarked to be fast tracked, Saunders has some special traits as does Wright who could easily transition into a fast outside mid, Curren looks like he's player for 4 years already and should get better as he adapts to the pace of AFL, Ross was starting to show plenty to suggest he could make it remembering it usually takes about 4 to 5 years to step up to an elite level for most mids.

i just hope we get the best player available not some one who is picked just because he dominates as an outside mid in the TAC cup.

Of course i have no idea who will become elite and neither do you so we are guessing but i do know that they all wont make it and most wont be elite. We can already say Armo will never be elite. he will just be a hard working honest mid at best.

And you can say that why? You can say that he hasn't so far but he had a few 30 + games and was BOG in at least 2 games this season. that is getting elite performance he just hasn't been consistent. I think he's at the cross roads where he could step it up and be A grade with some application or drag along with the occasional great game and hold his spot.

Geary is another who has ironed out his poor disposal and looks like he could move out of a backline post and move into a more on ball role. I never said we don't need mids just not exclusively and we should be looking at elite talent elsewhere on the field.

We have also got Savage for more of an on ball role than he played at the Hawks. We will need to fit 2 new kids plus the existing ones in the midfield while playing the young ones into form. If we neglect all other areas desperate for an elite mid we might do a Melbourne.

Not too many early mids end up elite. The best mids always seem to come between about 8 and 22 to me.

[plugger66]

I think we need mids of quality but if you look back over the drafts a lot of the elite mids are taken between 8 and 25 in the draft. Ball and Judd were an exceptional pair of highly rated mids but using your number one to five pick on a mid can often bring a Bryce Gibbs, Scully, Trengove etc.

Fyfe was pick 20 something from memory in 2009. I think the only other close to elite mid from that year was Dusty and he went at 3 but still is a fair way from elite. I don't over rate all our players and I said we need some but you can keep getting them in and sending them out but you need to play the ones you rate.

To get 5 very high quality mids you need to get them in and develop them. They obviously think those above are worth trying to develop because they are being given every chance. I didn't say we don't need them I just said it's over stated. If Longer was taken he is not a bad recruiting decision because he isn't a mid fielder.

There are some very good mids that should slide to the late teen early twenties. Dumont, Dunstan, Hartung, Tsitas, Kennedy Harris etc.

You have no idea who will become elite out of the guys currently on our list. I think Armo will improve again and was starting to show some real dominance, Jack obviously made the biggest leap forward, Newnes has been earmarked to be fast tracked, Saunders has some special traits as does Wright who could easily transition into a fast outside mid, Curren looks like he's player for 4 years already and should get better as he adapts to the pace of AFL, Ross was starting to show plenty to suggest he could make it remembering it usually takes about 4 to 5 years to step up to an elite level for most mids.

i just hope we get the best player available not some one who is picked just because he dominates as an outside mid in the TAC cup.

Of course i have no idea who will become elite and neither do you so we are guessing but i do know that they all wont make it and most wont be elite. We can already say Armo will never be elite. he will just be a hard working honest mid at best.

And you can say that why? You can say that he hasn't so far but he had a few 30 + games and was BOG in at least 2 games this season. that is getting elite performance he just hasn't been consistent. I think he's at the cross roads where he could step it up and be A grade with some application or drag along with the occasional great game and hold his spot.

Geary is another who has ironed out his poor disposal and looks like he could move out of a backline post and move into a more on ball role. I never said we don't need mids just not exclusively and we should be looking at elite talent elsewhere on the field.

We have also got Savage for more of an on ball role than he played at the Hawks. We will need to fit 2 new kids plus the existing ones in the midfield while playing the young ones into form. If we neglect all other areas desperate for an elite mid we might do a Melbourne.

Not too many early mids end up elite. The best mids always seem to come between about 8 and 22 to me.

That last line is a bit of junk really. the best mids in the last 10 years havent fallen in any of those picks at a guess. And i can say that about Armo because i have probably seen 95% of his games played. happy to show me a mid who went from and average player to elite in his 7th season.

[BigMart]

James Podsiadly does average 0.8 Hit outs a game.... Delisted
Tom Hawkins 1.9 Hit Outs per Game
Josh Walker 3.0 Hit Outs
Mitch Brown has never had a hit out at AFL level??
Ryan Bathie 0 games...... Delisted

Podsiadly and Hawkins are Key Fwds? Who contest the odd f50 throw in?
Walker is a fwd/part time 196 Ruck
Mitch Brown???
Ryan Bathie is a Delisted Rookie who played Full Back and Full Forward

Geelong are overstocked with Ruckman
Due to Bardy being injured for 2 years, Ottens retiring and the search for an emerger ..... Blicvas will end up rucking with Vardy..... They'll now ditch 2

[saintsRrising]

Geary is another who has ironed out his poor disposal and looks like he could move out of a backline post and move into a more on ball role..

IMO Geary is still a poor disposer of the ball when under pressure, which for mids is all the time. Happy for him to play BP with occasional runs on the ball, but if he has to play as a full-time mid where are in deep trouble.

[dragit]

James Podsiadly does average 0.8 Hit outs a game.... Delisted
Tom Hawkins 1.9 Hit Outs per Game
Josh Walker 3.0 Hit Outs
Mitch Brown has never had a hit out at AFL level??
Ryan Bathie 0 games...... Delisted

Podsiadly and Hawkins are Key Fwds? Who contest the odd f50 throw in?
Walker is a fwd/part time 196 Ruck
Mitch Brown???
Ryan Bathie is a Delisted Rookie who played Full Back and Full Forward

Geelong are overstocked with Ruckman
Due to Bardy being injured for 2 years, Ottens retiring and the search for an emerger ..... Blicvas will end up rucking with Vardy..... They'll now ditch 2

Hilarious, again!

You continually bemoan that our list isn't as good as Geelong's… now they have it wrong too.

Rhys Stanley averages 3 hitouts a game too…

Holmes is the definition of a project player, not taking up any space on the list…

So at the moment we have Hickey, Stanley & Pierce… probably get one of Longer/Jolly



I reckon you'd moan if you won tattslotto… cause the last winner got more.

Team needs 1 Ruckman, 1 Ruck/Fwd
2 Back ups....

Remember when McEvoy & Stanley were injured last year? We had Maister & Gilbert taking centre tapouts…

[St Ick]

I'm losing my patience this week.

I just want to see the following trades...

- 25 and 50odd for 19
- Longer for 25
- Bruce for 41
- Delaney for 77

- Polec was a #5 draft pick, a pick mid to late 20s should get it done, maybe even for a 4 pick downgrade!
- Docherty was a #12 draft pick, and they are debating as to whether to give them 31 or 32.
- Karnezis was #25, might go for pick 49 or 67.
- Yeo, pretty much kept his draft value but he showed a LOT of promise and probably exceeds his draft position on talent.

So why is it that they are playing hardball with us for Longer, a #8 pick? Is it the case that we actually have picks that seem reasonable to them so they would not being doing their due diligence to at least ask us.

Should we package together 19 & 25 to Port for 14 and Longer? Happy to give Port Stanley too to get pick 14. Would that deal get done, I am so keen on that #14 pick that they have.

Either way, I am a very average negotiator and I have zero patience for this game, I am worried that this period is going down like last year. If you remember last year, we got off to a flyer with the pick 12 trade, then spent two weeks deliberating over Hickey and Brown, only to almost throw the kitchen sink at Brown and then overpay a bit for Hickey. So this year we get off to a flyer with the McEvoy trade, then what... I'm worried that Bruce will turn his back on us especially now that GWS are splashing money back at him.

As I said, I'm no good at holding my nerve...

[BigMart]

Geelong got it very right..... Found Blicvas

[bobmurray]

James Podsiadly does average 0.8 Hit outs a game.... Delisted
Tom Hawkins 1.9 Hit Outs per Game
Josh Walker 3.0 Hit Outs
Mitch Brown has never had a hit out at AFL level??
Ryan Bathie 0 games...... Delisted

Podsiadly and Hawkins are Key Fwds? Who contest the odd f50 throw in?
Walker is a fwd/part time 196 Ruck
Mitch Brown???
Ryan Bathie is a Delisted Rookie who played Full Back and Full Forward

Geelong are overstocked with Ruckman
Due to Bardy being injured for 2 years, Ottens retiring and the search for an emerger ..... Blicvas will end up rucking with Vardy..... They'll now ditch 2

hey BM, whilst you were busy potting the club and it's decision making , it seems you missed the fact that the J-Pod was delisted and then picked up by Adelaide as an unrestricted free agent, hence he definitely won't be helping Geelong in the ruck. Okay, resume your potting.

[St Ick]

As for Geelong, what a shambles they are... they delisted club premiership stars Podsiadly, Hunt and Chapman, all who will be at other clubs for nothing. They lost that Ablett bloke a few years ago to some cellar dweller team. They also lost some Corey bloke to retirement with no respect or fanfare and have had players done for trafficking, didn't a few of their players get in trouble for staging a fake kidnapping? This year they tried to get Adams and couldn't even get him. They traded away a pick in the 30s last year for a injury prone ruckman who may never actually see a game in a Geelong jumper. What a joke of a club! Its easy to look at things glass half empty if you really want to.

[dragit]

Geelong got it very right..... Found Blicvas

Plenty of stuff ups along the way too

Kept Blake instead of King… Let Mumford go cheaply… McIntosh has been a complete failure.

I reckon if we'd have grabbed Blicavs you would be saying "how on earth can a steeplechaser play AFL football"

Let's hope Longer becomes better than Mac, Hickey becomes a footballer and Stanley can focus on being a forward.

[andrewg]

This made me feel better when I saw it, a bit of hope maybe:).

Are we re-writing history?

[plugger66]

This made me feel better when I saw it, a bit of hope maybe:).

Are we re-writing history?

Can we grab the guy in the PA jumper?

[ausfatcat]

This made me feel better when I saw it, a bit of hope maybe:).

Are we re-writing history?

Is that longer?

[andrewg]

yep it is

Loved reading this article in the courier mail from 2011 after he was drafted.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/afl ... 6205370632


"BRISBANE have capitalised on an AFL draft shock by snaring ruckman Billy Longer with their first choice at pick No.8. It was widely assumed GWS would nab the best ruckman in the draft but the Giants chose to stock up on midfielders and key position players, leaving All-Australian Longer free for Michael Voss to pounce."
"Voss admitted he was shocked that Longer was still available and said his selection followed the club's golden rule of choosing the best player available with their top pick. Longer has been compared with West Coast champion Dean Cox and because players of his size and agility are so hard to find it was a major shock that GWS did not grab him."

<script height="366px" width="650px" src="http://player.ooyala.com/iframe.js#ec=1 ... "></script>

[Dave McNamara]

As for Geelong, what a shambles they are... they delisted club premiership stars Podsiadly, Hunt and Chapman, all who will be at other clubs for nothing. They lost that Ablett bloke a few years ago to some cellar dweller team. They also lost some Corey bloke to retirement with no respect or fanfare and have had players done for trafficking, didn't a few of their players get in trouble for staging a fake kidnapping? This year they tried to get Adams and couldn't even get him. They traded away a pick in the 30s last year for a injury prone ruckman who may never actually see a game in a Geelong jumper. What a joke of a club! Its easy to look at things glass half empty if you really want to.

It's really interesting isn't it Ick?

Compare the above to our 'exploits', and we are looking pretty tame.

A fluky toe-poke here, and a fluky bounce there... and it's two flags to their one.

And this Geelong team/era is rightly rated as one of the all-time greats...

[St Ick]

As for Geelong, what a shambles they are... they delisted club premiership stars Podsiadly, Hunt and Chapman, all who will be at other clubs for nothing. They lost that Ablett bloke a few years ago to some cellar dweller team. They also lost some Corey bloke to retirement with no respect or fanfare and have had players done for trafficking, didn't a few of their players get in trouble for staging a fake kidnapping? This year they tried to get Adams and couldn't even get him. They traded away a pick in the 30s last year for a injury prone ruckman who may never actually see a game in a Geelong jumper. What a joke of a club! Its easy to look at things glass half empty if you really want to.

It's really interesting isn't it Ick?

Compare the above to our 'exploits', and we are looking pretty tame.

A fluky toe-poke here, and a fluky bounce there... and it's two flags to their one.

And this Geelong team/era is rightly rated as one of the all-time greats...

Exactly, and when you factor in Stevie J, Scarlo, and about half a dozen incidents down in Geelong pubs, then they really are lucky they got a point given a goal and a fluky toe poke as things seem to be ignored when teams taste success

[plugger66]

As for Geelong, what a shambles they are... they delisted club premiership stars Podsiadly, Hunt and Chapman, all who will be at other clubs for nothing. They lost that Ablett bloke a few years ago to some cellar dweller team. They also lost some Corey bloke to retirement with no respect or fanfare and have had players done for trafficking, didn't a few of their players get in trouble for staging a fake kidnapping? This year they tried to get Adams and couldn't even get him. They traded away a pick in the 30s last year for a injury prone ruckman who may never actually see a game in a Geelong jumper. What a joke of a club! Its easy to look at things glass half empty if you really want to.

It's really interesting isn't it Ick?

Compare the above to our 'exploits', and we are looking pretty tame.

A fluky toe-poke here, and a fluky bounce there... and it's two flags to their one.

And this Geelong team/era is rightly rated as one of the all-time greats...

Exactly, and when you factor in Stevie J, Scarlo, and about half a dozen incidents down in Geelong pubs, then they really are lucky they got a point given a goal and a fluky toe poke as things seem to be ignored when teams taste success

They had already won a flag. it wouldnt have changed how people feel about geelong but it would have changed how people feel about our club.

[BigMart]

Geelong have won 70% of games since 2007.... Not withstanding 2004 & 2005 prelims of which they lost one in bizarre circumstances...Nick Davis

The have been extraordinary and their list management and management have been the benchmark

They have had no priority picks or top 5 selections
The lost a once in a generation player due to expansion
They have turned over there list continually, but gradually
They have a dominant VFL set up
They have a stadium with lights
They have a Joel Selwood

They are the benchmark with Hawthorn, Sydney and now Freo IMO

[Dis Believer]

Geelong have won 70% of games since 2007.... Not withstanding 2004 & 2005 prelims of which they lost one in bizarre circumstances...Nick Davis

The have been extraordinary and their list management and management have been the benchmark

They have had no priority picks or top 5 selections
The lost a once in a generation player due to expansion
They have turned over there list continually, but gradually
They have a dominant VFL set up
They have a stadium with lights
They have a Joel Selwood

They are the benchmark with Hawthorn, Sydney and now Freo IMO

They also gained that once in a generation player for nix under father/son, and when he went he became two first round picks - the gift that keeps on giving hey. Not to mention half a dozen other quality players courtesy of father/son. Let's tell the whole story, not just the part that suits.......

[dragit]

Geelong have won 70% of games since 2007.... Not withstanding 2004 & 2005 prelims of which they lost one in bizarre circumstances...Nick Davis

The have been extraordinary and their list management and management have been the benchmark

They have had no priority picks or top 5 selections
The lost a once in a generation player due to expansion
They have turned over there list continually, but gradually
They have a dominant VFL set up
They have a stadium with lights
They have a Joel Selwood

They are the benchmark with Hawthorn, Sydney and now Freo IMO

They also gained that once in a generation player for nix under father/son, and when he went he became two first round picks - the gift that keeps on giving hey. Not to mention half a dozen other quality players courtesy of father/son. Let's tell the whole story, not just the part that suits.......

Their own stadium which generates millions of dollars for small crowds is handy too.

[St Ick]

Geelong have won 70% of games since 2007.... Not withstanding 2004 & 2005 prelims of which they lost one in bizarre circumstances...Nick Davis

The have been extraordinary and their list management and management have been the benchmark

They have had no priority picks or top 5 selections
The lost a once in a generation player due to expansion
They have turned over there list continually, but gradually
They have a dominant VFL set up
They have a stadium with lights
They have a Joel Selwood

They are the benchmark with Hawthorn, Sydney and now Freo IMO

I think we just found a new team for you to support buddy...

I guess it didn't hurt that their best player, their full back and their full forward came to the club for nix as f/s picks. Had they not won the flags, how would their treatment of the big O, Chappy, Hunt and Pods be viewed? They'd be as much a basket case as we are (in the eyes of some).

[MC Gusto]

If he walks to the psd wouldn't Mel or gws swoop?

[gringo]

Geelong have won 70% of games since 2007.... Not withstanding 2004 & 2005 prelims of which they lost one in bizarre circumstances...Nick Davis

The have been extraordinary and their list management and management have been the benchmark

They have had no priority picks or top 5 selections
The lost a once in a generation player due to expansion
They have turned over there list continually, but gradually
They have a dominant VFL set up
They have a stadium with lights
They have a Joel Selwood

They are the benchmark with Hawthorn, Sydney and now Freo IMO

I think we just found a new team for you to support buddy...

I guess it didn't hurt that their best player, their full back and their full forward came to the club for nix as f/s picks. Had they not won the flags, how would their treatment of the big O, Chappy, Hunt and Pods be viewed? They'd be as much a basket case as we are (in the eyes of some).

i know they are still up but I'm seeing the end coming. Bartell was looking old and slow in the finals at times and Corey and Chapman are heart and soul players. J pod was carrying the forward line because they couldn't get Hawkins fit. They only need injuries to a couple of a graders and they will drop sharply then as good as their kids have been along side their heroes they will become a middling team again.

Collingwood and Geelong will be back in the pack next year IMO both might struggle to make the top 4 and I can see the Pies struggling to make the 8. North, Richmond and Essendon could all be in the top 4 next year. Freo and Sydney should be challenging for those spots and Hawks are almost a given.

The middle group is improving with even Melbourne looking like it won't be a push over and GWS being a year older and bigger. We could be the worst team in the league next year.

[Ross who?]

My guess is YES they would. He is a massive talent. Not many other better players available.