The argument for Roo to leave St Kilda

[Dr Spaceman]

An absolute bloody champion of the club; albeit with a few minor flaws.

The leader; the skipper; the heart. The name that has used more gold leaf on the honours board at the club than any other.

You do not trade Nick Riewoldt. You simply don't!

And good luck with any membership drive if you do!

[Dis Believer]

There is no argument for Roo to leave the club.

End of discussion......

There certainly is an argument. Its matter for you whether you want to exchange ideas and engage with the issue or simply try and shout down any discussion on the topic.

As to comparing Roo with Hodge, I agree they are both inspiration leaders but the Saints and Hawks are poles apart in terms of their culture, achievements and current performance. As such the comparison is meaningless.

The premise of the argument is that neither Roo nor the club are going to get any closer to a premiership if he remains. Are we strong enough as a club to make some genuinely bold decisions rather than tinkering at edges to secure a premiership or 3 ?

Ok - how is this then - we will not win a flag during the time Roo has left in footy. Therefore, from the point of view of our club (which is all I am interested in), will he provide more value on our list or as trade bait? Given that he is clearly the best leader we have, and that we have a massively imbalanced list under development, and that he is probably the most marketable face of the club and best media performer, I think all that outweighs a high draft pick whilst we are under pressure and under performing on-field for the next two seasons.

[dragit]

Everyone has a price... Top 5 pick for nick? Maybe...

I really detest this 'chasing a flag' theme though... No glory in leaving a club that has paid you well for 10+ years... Choosing an already strong side to win some manufactured flag... Brian Lake, I'm talking about you ye flog. Paid ridiculous money at the dogs, but could hardly be arsed once finals were out if the question. Suddenly he loses his beer gut and magically finds form after joining the list in the country.. Get stuffed seriously...

These guys owe the club that took a chance on them, just as well Robert Harvey didn't F*** off in some awful times...

The competition would be ruined if every ageing star from a bottom 6 side left for top 4 sides... Particularly if they leave for low wages.

[The Redeemer]

Everyone has a price... Top 5 pick for nick? Maybe...

I really detest this 'chasing a flag' theme though... No glory in leaving a club that has paid you well for 10+ years... Choosing an already strong side to win some manufactured flag... Brian Lake, I'm talking about you ye flog. Paid ridiculous money at the dogs, but could hardly be arsed once finals were out if the question. Suddenly he loses his beer gut and magically finds form after joining the list in the country.. Get stuffed seriously...

These guys owe the club that took a chance on them, just as well Robert Harvey didn't F*** off in some awful times...

The competition would be ruined if every ageing star from a bottom 6 side left for top 4 sides... Particularly if they leave for low wages.

Robert Harvey was paid really well to play in a pathetic side at times.

Lake gave up a fair chunk of money.

That being stated with Lake, he had a pretty poor run with injury and was seemingly not part of the plans moving forward at the Kennel despite remaining talented.

It worked for all parties and so be it.

Do many of those story's tend to work out? no.

[SainterK]

He should stay..

But agree that the captaincy should be passed.

If people are worried nobody is quite up to it (I'm not one of them) why does it make sense to wait until he's gone?

Let someone take it on, while nick can mentor them.

IMO.

[dragit]

Everyone has a price... Top 5 pick for nick? Maybe...

I really detest this 'chasing a flag' theme though... No glory in leaving a club that has paid you well for 10+ years... Choosing an already strong side to win some manufactured flag... Brian Lake, I'm talking about you ye flog. Paid ridiculous money at the dogs, but could hardly be arsed once finals were out if the question. Suddenly he loses his beer gut and magically finds form after joining the list in the country.. Get stuffed seriously...

These guys owe the club that took a chance on them, just as well Robert Harvey didn't F*** off in some awful times...

The competition would be ruined if every ageing star from a bottom 6 side left for top 4 sides... Particularly if they leave for low wages.

Robert Harvey was paid really well to play in a pathetic side at times.

Lake gave up a fair chunk of money.

That being stated with Lake, he had a pretty poor run with injury and was seemingly not part of the plans moving forward at the Kennel despite remaining talented.

It worked for all parties and so be it.

Do many of those story's tend to work out? no.

Imagine of Harves had left for Essendon/Collingwood on a low wage late 90's... He'd have a flag... But there's no glory there IMO.

[dragit]

He should stay..

But agree that the captaincy should be passed.

If people are worried nobody is quite up to it (I'm not one of them) why does it make sense to wait until he's gone?

Let someone take it on, while nick can mentor them.

IMO.

Joey?

[SainterK]

Joey isn't much younger than Roo?

Don't see the point myself.

Depending on how long Milneys trial goes for, not sure we need our next captain giving evidence at the courts.

[dragit]

Joey isn't much younger than Roo?

Don't see the point myself.

Depending on how long Milneys trial goes for, not sure we need our next captain giving evidence at the courts.

I'm a Geary fan, but I'm not sure he's the answer... a bit blue collar, really need a star as the face of the club.

[Megamaguire]

The argument for Roo to finish his days @ St. K. is the winning argument.

GO SAINTS!

[SemperFidelis]

Here's 1 of the counter arguments, and I'm with Jake;

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/u ... 2v1a1.html
.

Thanks ToT; Jake Niall's article was worth a read if only for this absolute blinder of a line:

"St Kilda Football Club has to stand for something, besides the burning of small people and aberrant player behaviour. Saint Nick is among the rocks upon which this church is built."

Rhetoric aside, hard to disagree ...

[Con Gorozidis]

Here's 1 of the counter arguments, and I'm with Jake;

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/u ... 2v1a1.html
.

Thanks ToT; Jake Niall's article was worth a read if only for this absolute blinder of a line:

"St Kilda Football Club has to stand for something, besides the burning of small people and aberrant player behaviour. Saint Nick is among the rocks upon which this church is built."

Rhetoric aside, hard to disagree ...

What about the Len dog?
Shouldnt we stand for something bigger and more encompassing than one individual?
I dont think Roo leaving is or was ever on the cards.
But I dont think hes the be all and end all and pedestals.
We need a club that is strong and doesnt rely on any one person.

[SemperFidelis]

Con, I don't think we're in disagreement. To use Niall's rhetoric, Rooey is part of the foundation on which the club now stands. "Among the rocks".

Clearly so is Lenny. I would have put Dal there too but I don't want to start another argument about this. Then comes a proud recent history including the recent retirees, buckets, banger, burkey and ... well, you get the idea.

To borrow from Austinnn's other thread, I don't any of us really think Roo should be the messiah; obviously we have to spread the leadership load. It's just when the club - or some at the club - send the message that "everyone's up for trade at the right price", the foundations start to look shaky. We've been back-pedalling on that ever since, and it's allowed lazy journos to take free pot shots and label us a rabble ad nauseam at a time when the club has truly got more important things to deal with.

We all know our club stands for so much more, but we have to find sponsorship $, membership $ and god knows a buried treasure chest in the beach at Seaford. Like it or not, Roo remains one of the key planks in achieving that.

[BigMart]

Leigh Montagna would be my choice as skipper

[sunsaint]

An absolute bloody champion of the club; albeit with a few minor flaws.

The leader; the skipper; the heart. The name that has used more gold leaf on the honours board at the club than any other.

You do not trade Nick Riewoldt. You simply don't!

And good luck with any membership drive if you do!

Dont you read the papers
the club wasnt trading him,
HE was talking to collingwood

Hayes is our Hodge
Roo is our Franklin

[Scollop]

Ok - how is this then - we will not win a flag during the time Roo has left in footy. Therefore, from the point of view of our club (which is all I am interested in), will he provide more value on our list or as trade bait? Given that he is clearly the best leader we have, and that we have a massively imbalanced list under development, and that he is probably the most marketable face of the club and best media performer, I think all that outweighs a high draft pick whilst we are under pressure and under performing on-field for the next two seasons.

Great post TB.

I don't know what to think when there is talk of mass senior player exodus. I don't want the great Roo to leave and as you say -right now- he is worth just as much to the Saints for what he does off field than what he does on it.

I am confused and hope that Pelchen and Watters didn't seriously contemplate trading him. I also hope that Roo didn't seriously contemplate leaving

[Dr Spaceman]

An absolute bloody champion of the club; albeit with a few minor flaws.

The leader; the skipper; the heart. The name that has used more gold leaf on the honours board at the club than any other.

You do not trade Nick Riewoldt. You simply don't!

And good luck with any membership drive if you do!

Dont you read the papers
the club wasnt trading him,
HE was talking to collingwood

Hayes is our Hodge
Roo is our Franklin

But he's contracted. He only leaves if WE trade.

[Cairnsman]

I really thought Roo was lost to the club in 2011, especially early in that season.

Two seasons have passed since then and it is looking more and more like Roo will be a Saint for life.

Ones loyalty to a club in AFL is something that can only be judged at the end of a career.

[SainterK]

An absolute bloody champion of the club; albeit with a few minor flaws.

The leader; the skipper; the heart. The name that has used more gold leaf on the honours board at the club than any other.

You do not trade Nick Riewoldt. You simply don't!

And good luck with any membership drive if you do!

Dont you read the papers
the club wasnt trading him,
HE was talking to collingwood

Hayes is our Hodge
Roo is our Franklin

But he's contracted. He only leaves if WE trade.

If he initiated it, what could the club do?

[joffaboy]

But he's contracted. He only leaves if WE trade.

If he initiated it, what could the club do?[/quote]

say - you are contracted for 2014. go and train. Go for FA after 2014 and enjoy playing at Sandy and being stripped of the captaincy.

[SainterK]

I don't think he'll go for one minute.

Just curious if he said I want out...you think sitting it out at sandy is the answer?

[satchmo]

Leigh Montagna would be my choice as skipper

The dwarf hirer? Yeah he would be in the mix.

[SainterK]

Leigh Montagna would be my choice as skipper

The dwarf hirer? Yeah he would be in the mix.

I don't reckon he's a good fit, but thought I was the only one...

[satchmo]

Leigh Montagna would be my choice as skipper

The dwarf hirer? Yeah he would be in the mix.

I don't reckon he's a good fit, but thought I was the only one...

Doubt that he will ever be captain.
But I've been wrong before!

[groupie1]

There is no argument for Roo to leave the club.

End of discussion......

There certainly is an argument. Its matter for you whether you want to exchange ideas and engage with the issue or simply try and shout down any discussion on the topic.

As to comparing Roo with Hodge, I agree they are both inspiration leaders but the Saints and Hawks are poles apart in terms of their culture, achievements and current performance. As such the comparison is meaningless.

The premise of the argument is that neither Roo nor the club are going to get any closer to a premiership if he remains. Are we strong enough as a club to make some genuinely bold decisions rather than tinkering at edges to secure a premiership or 3 ?

"As to comparing Roo with Hodge, I agree they are both inspiration leaders but the Saints and Hawks are poles apart in terms of their culture, achievements and current performance. As such the comparison is meaningless."
The difference between Hawk success and Saint lack thereof doesn'r make the comparison meaningless at all. This is a silly idea.