A technical question

[Cairnsman]

Questions I have are:

Does anybody know anything about the GPS technology that AFL clubs use?

What actually does the device look like that the players wear in there jumper?

Clearly it is near the neck and between the shoulder blades. Is it small?

The device I imagine is padded and designed so that it wont hurt the player if impacted upon or pressed into the body.

Does it come out at the end of the game so the jumpers can be washed or are they water proof and permanently installed in the jumper.

Who designed the technology?

Does anybody know how the software works and what type of reports does it prepare. Do the coaching staff input into how the data is processed?

Who runs the technology for our club?

[Beekay]

Does it come out at the end of the game so the jumpers can be washed or are they water proof and permanently installed in the jumper.

[busso mick]

Maybe this link might help you.

http://www.gpsports.com/spiprox.php

[busso mick]

Does it come out at the end of the game so the jumpers can be washed or are they water proof and permanently installed in the jumper.

Maybe it can be placed on the dash so the players know how to get to / get out of Seaford

[saintbrat]

Does it come out at the end of the game so the jumpers can be washed or are they water proof and permanently installed in the jumper.

Maybe it can be placed on the dash so the players know how to get to / get out of Seaford

Nick said yesterday he gets excited about getting in the car and going to Seaford.

Re GPS
Small boxes are placed into the pockets now made into gameday jumpers - you see them putting them in and out at training or prior to games.

[Life Long Saint]

You didn't ask the really obvious question...

How the hell does GPS work when you play at a stadium with a closed roof and you don't have line of sight to three satellites?

[Cairnsman]

Maybe it can be placed on the dash so the players know how to get to / get out of Seaford

Nick said yesterday he gets excited about getting in the car and going to Seaford.

Re GPS
Small boxes are placed into the pockets now made into gameday jumpers - you see them putting them in and out at training or prior to games.

Bratty do you know who runs the technology for the club?

The website posted above states that Geelong were one of the first to introduce the technology. When did we start using it and I wonder what impact it has had on the sport in terms of significantly changing the way the coaching staff manage the team in particular how much is it exploited on game day?

[markp]

Does it come out at the end of the game so the jumpers can be washed or are they water proof and permanently installed in the jumper.

Spin cycle adds an extra 3k's.

[Cairnsman]

You didn't ask the really obvious question...

How the hell does GPS work when you play at a stadium with a closed roof and you don't have line of sight to three satellites?

So if that is how GPS technology works how do they get the system to work at the Dome?

[Life Long Saint]

You didn't ask the really obvious question...

How the hell does GPS work when you play at a stadium with a closed roof and you don't have line of sight to three satellites?

So if that is how GPS technology works how do they get the system to work at the Dome?

I am not sure they can.
I remember a Ross Lyon interview "On The Couch" a while back where he said as much.
GPS requires line of sight to at least three satellites to triangulate your position. It also struggles to work in the CBD as "canyoning" occurs where you have high structures around you limiting your line of sight.

You could simulate GPS in an arena by having three pseudo satellites inside the stadium but I am not sure they have that.

[Cairnsman]

You didn't ask the really obvious question...

How the hell does GPS work when you play at a stadium with a closed roof and you don't have line of sight to three satellites?

So if that is how GPS technology works how do they get the system to work at the Dome?

I am not sure they can.
I remember a Ross Lyon interview "On The Couch" a while back where he said as much.
GPS requires line of sight to at least three satellites to triangulate your position. It also struggles to work in the CBD as "canyoning" occurs where you have high structures around you limiting your line of sight.

You could simulate GPS in an arena by having three pseudo satellites inside the stadium but I am not sure they have that.

Interesting. Anyway assuming that it works I just wonder how each club exploits the technology because I suppose at the end of the day each club could develop it's own IP with regards to what data they record and how they interrogate that data. Each clubs game plan could potentially require the software to be designed a different way to suit its needs thus requiring the coaching staff to have a foundation of understanding of how the technology works. A skill set that wasn't required a decade ago I suppose. There are all sorts of different aspects to the storage and use of the information. Does the coach own it, does the club own it. How do they protect themselves from industrial espionage. All sorts of really interesting things going on behind the scenes I suppose...if that's what flicks ya switch that is.

[vergs]

Questions I have are:

Does anybody know anything about the GPS technology that AFL clubs use?

What actually does the device look like that the players wear in there jumper?

Clearly it is near the neck and between the shoulder blades. Is it small?

The device I imagine is padded and designed so that it wont hurt the player if impacted upon or pressed into the body.

Does it come out at the end of the game so the jumpers can be washed or are they water proof and permanently installed in the jumper.

Who designed the technology?

Does anybody know how the software works and what type of reports does it prepare. Do the coaching staff input into how the data is processed?

Who runs the technology for our club?

The GPS units are hard yet lightweight, just smaller in length and width than a credit card and approximately 2cm thick. The most popular GPS technology within the AFL is manufactured by Catapult Sports. The units are worn either within a tight pouch in the guernsey or in a custom designed vest to stop the device from moving around during the game. The GPS units can provide detailed information about the distance and speed at which a player is travelling as well as other measures of workload which have been created by the manufacturer. This can be done live to help monitor interchange rotations during a match or a report can be constructed post training/match for each individual player to assess their physical performance. This is the role of the sports scientist/performance analyst however coaches will have some input into how individual players or groups of players (eg midfielders) are assessed. Even with the roof open at Etihad stadium there is too much structual interference for the GPS units to be effective. However, there are devices that have built in accelerometers which can collect data from other movement demands without the need for a satellite signal, therefore these devices can still be useful indoors.

[Cairnsman]

Questions I have are:

Does anybody know anything about the GPS technology that AFL clubs use?

What actually does the device look like that the players wear in there jumper?

Clearly it is near the neck and between the shoulder blades. Is it small?

The device I imagine is padded and designed so that it wont hurt the player if impacted upon or pressed into the body.

Does it come out at the end of the game so the jumpers can be washed or are they water proof and permanently installed in the jumper.

Who designed the technology?

Does anybody know how the software works and what type of reports does it prepare. Do the coaching staff input into how the data is processed?

Who runs the technology for our club?

The GPS units are hard yet lightweight, just smaller in length and width than a credit card and approximately 2cm thick. The most popular GPS technology within the AFL is manufactured by Catapult Sports. The units are worn either within a tight pouch in the guernsey or in a custom designed vest to stop the device from moving around during the game. The GPS units can provide detailed information about the distance and speed at which a player is travelling as well as other measures of workload which have been created by the manufacturer. This can be done live to help monitor interchange rotations during a match or a report can be constructed post training/match for each individual player to assess their physical performance. This is the role of the sports scientist/performance analyst however coaches will have some input into how individual players or groups of players (eg midfielders) are assessed. Even with the roof open at Etihad stadium there is too much structual interference for the GPS units to be effective. However, there are devices that have built in accelerometers which can collect data from other movement demands without the need for a satellite signal, therefore these devices can still be useful indoors.

Sounds like you know a bit about it Vergs. It also sounds like if your home ground is the Hootchie then you need to have a management system that doesn't rely on the GPS technology. You mentioned the accelerometers and so are there any clubs using this to circumvent the technical issues. Do the Saints use it?

So Vergs can you link or integrate the GPS system with say the champion data system to also assist with match day activities such as tactics and game plan management or is it only used to measure the players physiological outputs?

[mr six o'clock]

the people who make and sell these gizmo's are laughing all the way to the bank !
Whilst they aid the coaching panel to a degree , you aint gunna win a premiership with a side full of average players you know (because of the gps ) where's the right spot on the ground they should be at any one time !

[vergs]

Sounds like you know a bit about it Vergs. It also sounds like if your home ground is the Hootchie then you need to have a management system that doesn't rely on the GPS technology. You mentioned the accelerometers and so are there any clubs using this to circumvent the technical issues. Do the Saints use it?

So Vergs can you link or integrate the GPS system with say the champion data system to also assist with match day activities such as tactics and game plan management or is it only used to measure the players physiological outputs?

As Life Long Saint mentioned it is possible to integrate technology within an indoor stadium that allows GPS to be effective but this is fairly expensive to do. I have heard that it is on the AFL's agenda though. All clubs would use GPS whenever possible. I'm not certain how much importance the Saints place on accelerometer data but I know that the Bulldogs use it in certain capacities and given they are also a tenant at Etihad then you could assume that the Saints would use it. GPS is effective at measuring running patterns and workload which enables the analysis of the physiological performance of a player and guides training prescription. Accelerometers have the advantage of being able to quantify player impacts such as kicks, tackles, and bumps which GPS cannot do. The GPS output provides a substantial amount of data however clubs may vary in the way they use this information in regards to tactics, player positions, roles etc. There is no gold standard of measurement so clubs will generally use a variety of measures to get a comprehensive analysis of player performance. There is limited research available that has investigated which GPS variables may be a predictor of match performance however it is currently being looked into. It has been found that a greater time spent running above 15kmph correlates with a greater number of disposals but there are obviously other factors which may effect disposal count which GPS cannot account for.

[Beekay]

Does it come out at the end of the game so the jumpers can be washed or are they water proof and permanently installed in the jumper.

Spin cycle adds an extra 3k's.

Someone should have told the coach before he abused him for running around in circles.

[Cairnsman]

Sounds like you know a bit about it Vergs. It also sounds like if your home ground is the Hootchie then you need to have a management system that doesn't rely on the GPS technology. You mentioned the accelerometers and so are there any clubs using this to circumvent the technical issues. Do the Saints use it?

So Vergs can you link or integrate the GPS system with say the champion data system to also assist with match day activities such as tactics and game plan management or is it only used to measure the players physiological outputs?

As Life Long Saint mentioned it is possible to integrate technology within an indoor stadium that allows GPS to be effective but this is fairly expensive to do. I have heard that it is on the AFL's agenda though. All clubs would use GPS whenever possible. I'm not certain how much importance the Saints place on accelerometer data but I know that the Bulldogs use it in certain capacities and given they are also a tenant at Etihad then you could assume that the Saints would use it. GPS is effective at measuring running patterns and workload which enables the analysis of the physiological performance of a player and guides training prescription. Accelerometers have the advantage of being able to quantify player impacts such as kicks, tackles, and bumps which GPS cannot do. The GPS output provides a substantial amount of data however clubs may vary in the way they use this information in regards to tactics, player positions, roles etc. There is no gold standard of measurement so clubs will generally use a variety of measures to get a comprehensive analysis of player performance. There is limited research available that has investigated which GPS variables may be a predictor of match performance however it is currently being looked into. It has been found that a greater time spent running above 15kmph correlates with a greater number of disposals but there are obviously other factors which may effect disposal count which GPS cannot account for.

It sounds like the accelerometers being used are fairly tricked up pieces of kit especially if they can measure events such as kicks, tackles and bumps. I wonder if there are clubs using GPS and accelerometers in combination. Makes sense to me in terms of the increased data capturing and crunching. It would move it way beyond just the physiological management I suppose. In my profession I live my a saying that goes "if you can't measure it, you can't manage it", you've probably heard it if you are across this particular subject and so I can really see this being the next quantum leap in coaching.