Worries - BJ, young-gun mids, & where to from here?

[Kiedis]

So in the post/pre-season a lot was spoken of Goddard. Naturally.

& a lot was spoken of the benefit of letting him go. Sure we got a compo pick, but that was always going to be nothing more than a sweetener for losing an irreplaceable. A former #1 pick. A St Kilda champ.

But the real benefit, so I've constantly been told, was freeing up our salary cap.

Tracking how we've been going so far this season, and all the opinion on here, many now hold the view that we ain't convincing any young stars to come join the mighty Saints. Why would they want to?
I don't mean to be yet another re-opening the Goddard wound.. I know It's pointless..

But what the hell are we actually getting out of this decision?

I also realize there really is no point in trying to judge this until we at least see what happens end of the season.. I just feel like It's been a year-long reassurance of having a secret ace up our sleeve, that never eventuates. I'm just feeling pretty discontent with how It's all panned out thus far.

Caddy - nup. Brown - nup. Secret ace - nup. TDL - yep.

Bottom 4 - yep.

I have no idea who we'll pick up end of the season. I hope it surprises. But if we can't even target a potential A grade young mid, though relatively untried, wanting to return from one of the expansion teams..

I have to ask, what was the benefit of letting BJ go?

The way we're going at the moment, BJ would be my first choice to have in the team to lead & mould our kids. He's a sook, he's angry, yada yada.

He's a leader. He's passionate. He's a competitive beast. And he WAS st kilda through & through. Our next captain.

Now we don't even have a suitable replacement for Roo.

Well there you go, wound re-opened.

I bring this up as I'm very interested to hear others opinions. Hold my hand and drink the cool aid with me, reassure me, flame me, whatever.

I'm just really starting to see a glaring BJ shaped hole in the side now. Especially from the perspective of leading & grooming our next core.

Please discuss.

[Con Gorozidis]

If we can get two young gun silky goal kicking mids at years end + Mitch Brown (for bugger all) Ill be happy.

Then we really need Tom Lee to improve bigtime - and well be ok.

[spert]

Amazing how people were bagging BJ on this forum years ago, wanting him dropped etc, but the potential could be seen. I see potential in Webster, Newnes, Wright and to a lesser extent Ross. We need to give Lee a series of games in the seniors to see what eventuates, and I expect he will be a useful player.

[noob]

Just need to recruit our own superstars through our draft picks. Don't want a Tom Scully where we see potential in a kid, pay overs and gets on big money and does nothing.

[busso mick]

Can one person make that big a difference to us? It's all hypothetical of course, but how do you think we would have gone this year with BJ in our side? My guess is we might have had one more win. The form and fitness of a lot of our older blokes are the main reason we are sitting near the bottom. I was disappointed he left as well but I don't believe him leaving is the major reason we are floundering at the moment. I agree with you about the leadership gap though because at the moment we are looking a bit rudderless, Roo aside.

[dragit]

I also realize there really is no point in trying to judge this until we at least see what happens end of the season..

We won't be able to judge this decision for another 5 years I'd say.

Hickey & White (& TDL) is basically our direct swap for losing Goddard, plus the cap room.

I hear your pain and who knows if it will work out well for us in the end, but from what I understand, if we'd kept Goddard then we would have certainly lost another very good player.

I'm sure the club assessed the list and the serious lack of young talent at the club and got proactive, backed themselves to pick a couple of very good players for the future rather than continue to max out our cap for 4 years to pay a player who lets be honest, had been down on his best for 2 years.

Hickey & White are both years away from their best & none of us know if they will even be C graders yet, but in 5 years time we could have had BJ hobbling towards 300 games or we could potentially have 2 very good players entering their prime.

*I can't see TDL being at the club then unfortunately.

[Con Gorozidis]

If Bj Stayed he just be going through the motions and playing half-assed and copping abuse from Saintsational.

[Sobraz]

We have to pay 95% of the cap??..

God knows to who, but there is going to be some barely established mid rangers that have hit the jackpot..

[busso mick]

We have to pay 95% of the cap??..

God knows to who, but there is going to be some barely established mid rangers that have hit the jackpot..

Armo and Stanley both signed long term deals this year.

[plugger66]

We have to pay 95% of the cap??..

God knows to who, but there is going to be some barely established mid rangers that have hit the jackpot..

We may have paid well over 100% this year with veterans. If are allowed not to have veterans next year then we will probably drop a million dollars in the salary cap to get to 95% so it shouldnt have to overpay players next year. we may in the following years though.

[dragit]

I'm sure they will look at locking away Wright, Roberton, Newnes & Ross for a few years, certainly can't afford to lose any young talent.

[skeptic]

BJ's form simply wasn't good enough to warrant the money he wanted

keep in mind that he wanted north of $750k reportedly and I think got it

that's right up with the very elite in our game minus the expansion club stars... is he really that good?

personally I don't think so

[SaintPav]

BJ's form simply wasn't good enough to warrant the money he wanted

keep in mind that he wanted north of $750k reportedly and I think got it

that's right up with the very elite in our game minus the expansion club stars... is he really that good?

personally I don't think so

How do you know he wanted 750K from St Kilda?

Essendon may have had to offer him that much to leave but I don't think anyone would have a clue about the exact number. It was reported that he wanted a 4th year but that's all I ever read.

You may know something more though.

[paddy]

why bother keeping him?

its not like we would be top 4 with him....

i miss him... but still think it was mutually beneficial.

[maverick]

Said it at the time and will say it again, whilst he may not be worth the money as a pure player going forward, his experience and value to our supporters far outweighs any short term salary relief which we did SFA with.

As I said at the time, reckon this has cost at least 5000 members this year alone.

It's a signal that the cue is in the rack for the next couple of years at least.

[Kiedis]

BJ's form simply wasn't good enough to warrant the money he wanted

keep in mind that he wanted north of $750k reportedly and I think got it

that's right up with the very elite in our game minus the expansion club stars... is he really that good?

personally I don't think so

Yeah I agree, in a perfect world, shouldn't have had to pay him that much.

I'm just now looking at the less than solid shot we've got of replacing that talent, with some 'genuine' talent.

And the fact that we have to pay 95% of the cap regardless.

I guess what I'm saying is I won't feel so bad if like a previous poster said, we pick up a couple of silky-skilled midfielders, something, anything..

Just want the actual benefits of this freed up salary cap (ie. a sound replacement) pretty bad at this point!

Hope something good happens this draft/trade period.

[spert]

If Goddard wanted to stay at the Saints, he would still be there regardless of whatever offers were around- instead of being a highly paid young man with a high opinion of himself, he wanted to be an ever higher paid young man with a high opinion of himself..with a little help no doubt from his manager who's pay packet would also increase as a result. Let's move on.

[Kiedis]

Said it at the time and will say it again, whilst he may not be worth the money as a pure player going forward, his experience and value to our supporters far outweighs any short term salary relief which we did SFA with.

As I said at the time, reckon this has cost at least 5000 members this year alone.

It's a signal that the cue is in the rack for the next couple of years at least.

This.

On playing ability alone, nah, I get that..

Where we're at now with trying to re-build, teach & mould the next great st kilda team?


.. I'd kill for the complete package that BJ brings.


Without a genuine alternative to Roo waiting in the wings.. & having just turned 28. I was of the opinion BJ was the perfect man for the job to lead & rebuild this team around. Who better (given the age of our remaining exceptional leaders) to try & expunge every last bit of essence/magic dust from the great St Kilda team we've loved over the past decade & inject into this new lot.

It's a big ask what we must now do.

[Kiedis]

If Goddard wanted to stay at the Saints, he would still be there regardless of whatever offers were around- instead of being a highly paid young man with a high opinion of himself, he wanted to be an ever higher paid young man with a high opinion of himself..with a little help no doubt from his manager who's pay packet would also increase as a result. Let's move on.

And then, sadly, there is this.

[maverick]

If Goddard wanted to stay at the Saints, he would still be there regardless of whatever offers were around- instead of being a highly paid young man with a high opinion of himself, he wanted to be an ever higher paid young man with a high opinion of himself..with a little help no doubt from his manager who's pay packet would also increase as a result. Let's move on.

Make no mistake, the Saints wanted him to leave

[Dis Believer]

If BJ had stayed, how would we have been postioned to secure say a 23-24 year old KPD from another club, as an example? It's not just BJ, and I get the leadership/experience thing in terms of mentoring younger players, but the fact is that we need to replenish, and a half-back flanker on $700k (albeit a very talented one) inhibits our ability to replenish in other key areas.
As a result of paying that $700k we would have a HBF rated 10 out of 10, but potentially a CHB or FB who rates 4 out of 10.
If we can secure a CHB (or a full back) that rates 7 or 8 out of 10, and replace BJ with a HBF that rates 7 out of 10 are we a better team? I think so. I think given what we are going through right now, BJ would make little difference to our on field outcomes.
I also think there are others capable of providing the leadership for this year and next. By the end of next year if guys like Big MAc and Armo are not providing the bulk of onfield leadership, then we have issues. I also think Roberton is going to be an absolute gun leader in a very short space of time. In fact I think he will be our backline general by the end of this year.

[maverick]

If BJ had stayed, how would we have been postioned to secure say a 23-24 year old KPD from another club, as an example? It's not just BJ, and I get the leadership/experience thing in terms of mentoring younger players, but the fact is that we need to replenish, and a half-back flanker on $700k (albeit a very talented one) inhibits our ability to replenish in other key areas.
As a result of paying that $700k we would have a HBF rated 10 out of 10, but potentially a CHB or FB who rates 4 out of 10.
If we can secure a CHB (or a full back) that rates 7 or 8 out of 10, and replace BJ with a HBF that rates 7 out of 10 are we a better team? I think so. I think given what we are going through right now, BJ would make little difference to our on field outcomes.
I also think there are others capable of providing the leadership for this year and next. By the end of next year if guys like Big MAc and Armo are not providing the bulk of onfield leadership, then we have issues. I also think Roberton is going to be an absolute gun leader in a very short space of time. In fact I think he will be our backline general by the end of this year.

So which 23-24 year old did we get?

[Dis Believer]

If BJ had stayed, how would we have been postioned to secure say a 23-24 year old KPD from another club, as an example? It's not just BJ, and I get the leadership/experience thing in terms of mentoring younger players, but the fact is that we need to replenish, and a half-back flanker on $700k (albeit a very talented one) inhibits our ability to replenish in other key areas.
As a result of paying that $700k we would have a HBF rated 10 out of 10, but potentially a CHB or FB who rates 4 out of 10.
If we can secure a CHB (or a full back) that rates 7 or 8 out of 10, and replace BJ with a HBF that rates 7 out of 10 are we a better team? I think so. I think given what we are going through right now, BJ would make little difference to our on field outcomes.
I also think there are others capable of providing the leadership for this year and next. By the end of next year if guys like Big MAc and Armo are not providing the bulk of onfield leadership, then we have issues. I also think Roberton is going to be an absolute gun leader in a very short space of time. In fact I think he will be our backline general by the end of this year.

So which 23-24 year old did we get?

None yet, but I would suggest you watch this space. Maybe get back to me after the next off-season.....

[Kiedis]

Lord I hope we go well in the draft/trade periods this year..

Shitting them about making the most of our picks - really want to hit the nail on the head this time with the obvious 'right' choice & get maximum worth. In recent times have been left wanting in that regard..

For a change, It'd be nice to be the team unearthing a Cotchin, a Wines.


If we come out of this with Mitch Brown & not much else, I do wonder what people will then think..

All just speculation I know, & I bloody hope It's the good outcome! Just jaded. What can I say, I'm a saints man.

[skeptic]

How do you know he wanted 750K from St Kilda?

Essendon may have had to offer him that much to leave but I don't think anyone would have a clue about the exact number. It was reported that he wanted a 4th year but that's all I ever read.

You may know something more though.

Fair call Saint Pav,

like most on here I have no idea... just go on what I hear in the media and read here