Blow

[satchmo]

The ghost of Goldc**ts future..

[Iceman234]

How many see the bigger picture of organised crime involvement?

Cocaine doesn't get purchased in Woolworths or Chemist Warehouse.

It comes from illicit drug traffickers, most of whom ultimately are controlled by large organised crime syndicates, including Asian/European/Colombian drug cartels. Many driven locally by outlaw bikie gangs. Bikie gangs have fingers in many pies including night clubs, pubs, strip joints and brothels. No surprises there. Seems like a glamorous lifestyle until jailed, but the bottom line that is funding up the line is the street druggie breaking into your car/house/business. Always the lowest common denominator, yet within just a couple of degrees of separation from our revered "heroes".

For a high profile footballer/s to become entrenched in this culture doesn't take much persuasion, especially when offered drinks cards, lap dances, hookers, hoovers and the gangster lifestyle. Might not seem a gangster lifestyle to them at the time while snorting the crap, but it certainly elevates them in certain social circles. Wrong circles.

[ShanghaiSaint]

So you reckon any of our lads might have tested +ve for blow?

i dont really care, as long as they stay out of the papers and train and play well.

[Iceman234]

So you reckon any of our lads might have tested +ve for blow?

i dont really care, as long as they stay out of the papers and train and play well.

I care.

Not just for their personal health and welfare, but the impact it can have across the board.

Really, is cocaine/illicit drugs accepted in general society? If I found out one of my work colleagues or one of my other mates was on the gear I would be filthy and would have no hesitation in getting them help, rather than saying "hope they do their job ok".

If it was one of my kids I would be devastated and would do anything within reason/legal to help them.

Really? Is it that accepted?

I must live a sheltered life...

[dragit]

So you reckon any of our lads might have tested +ve for blow?

i dont really care, as long as they stay out of the papers and train and play well.

I care.

Not just for their personal health and welfare, but the impact it can have across the board.

Really, is cocaine/illicit drugs accepted in general society? If I found out one of my work colleagues or one of my other mates was on the gear I would be filthy and would have no hesitation in getting them help, rather than saying "hope they do their job ok".

If it was one of my kids I would be devastated and would do anything within reason/legal to help them.

Really? Is it that accepted?

I must live a sheltered life...

I think you might be over-stating the impact of recreational drug use… Sure any substance can be abused to the point of consuming and destroying lives, but it is also possible to use drugs in moderation without spiraling out of control, not that different to alcohol in that regard IMO.
If a friend or colleague took ecstasy or smoked a joint on a weekend every now an then, I think you could be out of line 'getting them help'.
Young people will party and try drugs, that's just inevitable, how they handle and manage their own experiences and experimentation is really up to them as adults.

[ShanghaiSaint]

So you reckon any of our lads might have tested +ve for blow?

i dont really care, as long as they stay out of the papers and train and play well.

I care.

Not just for their personal health and welfare, but the impact it can have across the board.

Really, is cocaine/illicit drugs accepted in general society? If I found out one of my work colleagues or one of my other mates was on the gear I would be filthy and would have no hesitation in getting them help, rather than saying "hope they do their job ok".

If it was one of my kids I would be devastated and would do anything within reason/legal to help them.

Really? Is it that accepted?

I must live a sheltered life...

Back in my 20s i hit clubs had a pill or two... did not affect my personal or work life... so i dont see a massive big deal with it. Seen more violence and destruction caused by drinking when out on the town. it's all about balance with anything in life... that being said i would prefer they didn't do it but they're grown men the choice is up to them.

[satchmo]

So you reckon any of our lads might have tested +ve for blow?

i dont really care, as long as they stay out of the papers and train and play well.

I care.

Not just for their personal health and welfare, but the impact it can have across the board.

Really, is cocaine/illicit drugs accepted in general society? If I found out one of my work colleagues or one of my other mates was on the gear I would be filthy and would have no hesitation in getting them help, rather than saying "hope they do their job ok".

If it was one of my kids I would be devastated and would do anything within reason/legal to help them.

Really? Is it that accepted?

I must live a sheltered life...

All of the above is correct.

This subject is beyond the scope of a mere football forum IMHO.

Drug use is rampant in our society. I'd say that is a fact.
But to seriously address these issues requires much more of an open mind than most of us are willing to offer.

[ShanghaiSaint]

the shiit going on at BUMMERLand is a bigger deal to me as that is on the line of cheating.

[Iceman234]

i dont really care, as long as they stay out of the papers and train and play well.[/quote]

I care.

Not just for their personal health and welfare, but the impact it can have across the board.

Really, is cocaine/illicit drugs accepted in general society? If I found out one of my work colleagues or one of my other mates was on the gear I would be filthy and would have no hesitation in getting them help, rather than saying "hope they do their job ok".

If it was one of my kids I would be devastated and would do anything within reason/legal to help them.

Really? Is it that accepted?

I must live a sheltered life...[/quote]
I think you might be over-stating the impact of recreational drug use… Sure any substance can be abused to the point of consuming and destroying lives, but it is also possible to use drugs in moderation without spiraling out of control, not that different to alcohol in that regard IMO.
If a friend or colleague took ecstasy or smoked a joint on a weekend every now an then, I think you could be out of line 'getting them help'.
Young people will party and try drugs, that's just inevitable, how they handle and manage their own experiences and experimentation is really up to them as adults.[/quote]

Clearly I've been sheltered then for my life...

Overstating the impact of "recreational drug use"? By elite athletes? Using drugs supplied by organised crime? Making them susceptible to match-fixing? Happens every day around the world, predominantly with soccer and cricket, but also entering the world of smaller games like ours and even lower than ours. OS based bookies are getting their hooks in to every game, would take crooked bets on two flies crawling up a wall and then which one would leave a s*** mark on the wall first, at what time and what measurement from where they started...all independent spot-fixing bets. Aussies need to pull their heads out of their arses and realise how well the AFL is actually handling this and how far ahead they are of other sports.

In my group of colleagues and good friends I would not be out of line in getting them, or at least offering them, help - if they were taking illicit drugs, but thanks for the advice that I'd be out of line. I'll take that on board.

[Iceman234]

All of the above is correct.

This subject is beyond the scope of a mere football forum IMHO.

Drug use is rampant in our society. I'd say that is a fact.
But to seriously address these issues requires much more of an open mind than most of us are willing to offer.

Drug use accounts for probably around 70% of our crime stats overall, realistically probably closer to 80-90% I reckon.

I endorse your comment re the beyond the scope of a football forum. Of course it is but that doesn't preclude us from hearing the opinions of others. I look forward to the ASADA hearings becoming public, however I personally think the bigger problem will ultimately be the elephant in the room, cocaine and other drugs.

[ShanghaiSaint]

All of the above is correct.

This subject is beyond the scope of a mere football forum IMHO.

Drug use is rampant in our society. I'd say that is a fact.
But to seriously address these issues requires much more of an open mind than most of us are willing to offer.

Drug use accounts for probably around 70% of our crime stats overall, realistically probably closer to 80-90% I reckon.

I endorse your comment re the beyond the scope of a football forum. Of course it is but that doesn't preclude us from hearing the opinions of others. I look forward to the ASADA hearings becoming public, however I personally think the bigger problem will ultimately be the elephant in the room, cocaine and other drugs.

Iceman I hear u and respect your opinion. my dad's factory is in Springvale... I worked there for a couple years in the peak of the heroin days in Springvale. I have seen first hand what it does, we dealt with junkies on a daily basis. trying to steal out of you car and shooting up next to our factory/needles all over the place.. But there's having a line here and there and hammering three grams up your nose each day... balance and control.. but i prefer that our players are not taking any type of illegal drugs

i personally just don't see it as such a big deal these days.

[Iceman234]

All of the above is correct.

This subject is beyond the scope of a mere football forum IMHO.

Drug use is rampant in our society. I'd say that is a fact.
But to seriously address these issues requires much more of an open mind than most of us are willing to offer.

Drug use accounts for probably around 70% of our crime stats overall, realistically probably closer to 80-90% I reckon.

I endorse your comment re the beyond the scope of a football forum. Of course it is but that doesn't preclude us from hearing the opinions of others. I look forward to the ASADA hearings becoming public, however I personally think the bigger problem will ultimately be the elephant in the room, cocaine and other drugs.

Iceman I hear u and respect your opinion. my dad's factory is in Springvale... I worked there for a couple years in the peak of the heroine days in Springvale. I have seen first hand what it does, we dealt with junkies on a daily basis. trying to steal out of you car and shooting up next to our factory/needles all over the place.. But there's having a line here and there and hammering three grams up your nose each day... balance and control.. but i prefer that our players are not taking any type of illegal drugs

i personally just don't see it as such a big deal these days.

I appreciate that, but don't think it couldn't for a second be our boys, or our kids, supplementing the incomes of OC figures...it is a big deal, my thoughts are that the AFL is doing everything they can but I just get disappointed by others that it's accepted. It is a huge issue and will get bigger...it's a great life to be in a place where we think our sports people are not involved in match fixing. But even team sports can be corrupted.

[ShanghaiSaint]

I appreciate that, but don't think it couldn't for a second be our boys, or our kids, supplementing the incomes of OC figures...it is a big deal, my thoughts are that the AFL is doing everything they can but I just get disappointed by others that it's accepted. It is a huge issue and will get bigger...it's a great life to be in a place where we think our sports people are not involved in match fixing. But even team sports can be corrupted.

I do see why you think it's important as these guys are role models for younger guys/kids... and monkey see monkey do. I agree that the AFL should stamp it out.. as it's A not good to do and B a very bad look for impressionable young minds. I was a bit blunt in my first comment.

[bigred]

honestly and i might be alone in this but i really couldnt care less if players are on rec drugs on their down time ... it is after all their life to stuff up how ever they like ... what i expect from footballers is to train hard and play the game as hard as they can what they do in their own time is up to them as long as it doesnt effect their training and playing ability and they dont get into trouble with the law then i could care less...

That's interesting. Most people including probably myself would have the same view.

So basically we only care about the players in the context of playing performance and how well they play? What about the health and personal impacts drugs have on players etc?

Philosophically this concept does not sit well with me as it's selfish and sad. Viewing players as a commodity is a reflection of our society we live in; just like profit over people.

Maybe we care more about players having the freedom to choose how they treat their bodies etc. I like that better so I'll go with that.

That's pretty much it in a nutshell.

And its why so many have dobbed them self in for the get out of jail card. They don't give a stuff. The AFL need to get over themselves....seriously.

[Iceman234]

bigred, interested in why you think the AFL need to get over themselves?

[magnifisaint]

What is blow?

[bigred]

The AFL need to get over themselves because they are doing the ILLICIT drug testing for the wrong reasons. They want to be world police. I get drug tested at work once every six months or so, purely for OH &S reasons.

Why are the AFL doing their testing?

Regardless, its all a load of bulltish with the 3 strikes rubbish. That is so far removed from the real world it isnt funny.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

honestly and i might be alone in this but i really couldnt care less if players are on rec drugs on their down time ... it is after all their life to stuff up how ever they like ... what i expect from footballers is to train hard and play the game as hard as they can what they do in their own time is up to them as long as it doesnt effect their training and playing ability and they dont get into trouble with the law then i could care less...

That's interesting. Most people including probably myself would have the same view.

So basically we only care about the players in the context of playing performance and how well they play? What about the health and personal impacts drugs have on players etc?

Philosophically this concept does not sit well with me as it's selfish and sad. Viewing players as a commodity is a reflection of our society we live in; just like profit over people.

Maybe we care more about players having the freedom to choose how they treat their bodies etc. I like that better so I'll go with that.

make no mistake i would rather that no one in society found the need to take rec drugs but this is the real world for a varriety of reasond people are going to look for that high . these guys are grown men some will say 18 is not grown up but i disagree by 18 you know whats right and whats wrong and you have the ability to choose what you wish to do now some of these players choose to snort coke .. fine their choice just like the guy servicing my car might choose to snort it or the girl processing my home insurance might choose to snort it ... the point is its thier choice and as long as it doesnt effect their day to day roles most people wouldnt care .... i reserve the care for the people i actually know the people i can influence change in not a person who i dont know and would care less about me ...

[Johnny Member]

The 'issue' is that Anderson did his usual thing and stood up in front of everyone and beat his chest about how wonderful him and the AFL were and that they had this great policy that he came up with that was 'winning the war on drugs'! He had the figures to prove it apparently. And he spruiked them like he did for every other s*** idea he had.


When you do that, which the AFL is famous for, people take offence at being treated like idiots and will react.


So in reality, these figures are a waste of time and don't tell us anything. They don't tell us, like Anderson tried to spin, that the AFL are leading the way and are the only organisation in the world capable of beating drugs - and they also don't tell us there is a drug problem in the sport.

According to Demetriou (and I'm starting to feel guilty for blaming him for how s*** the AFL is now that Anderson is gone) it's purely designed to allow them to assist players who may have a drug problem.

Therefore the numbers are irrelevant. Therefore Anderson shouldn't have been spruiking how great he was when they were low.

And in turn, none of us should care what the numbers are.

[matrix]

great movie

[Johnny Member]

People show their age, and ignorance to a degree, when talking about drugs.


Here's the deal:

Drugs can f*** you up really bad.

So can gambling.
So can drinking.
So can eating.
Hell, so can online gaming these days!

But none of the above categorically f*** you up.


Many, many people take drugs, and you would never even know it. They are responsible about it and know their limitations. Same with gambling, drinking and anything else.

The thing with drugs, is that they make you feel good. That's the point of them. If they made you feel s*** - no one would take them!


So when we tell kids "don't take drugs, they're bad!", and as part of being young they get curious and take them anyway - they feel good and instantly think that we don't know what the hell we're talking about! They have the time of their lives, and think that the old dudes who told them how bad drugs are must just be being kill joys.

The other thing with drugs, is that it's easier to take them regularly, which is a trap. If you got pissed every night, the hangovers alone would make you change your mind and pull back! But you can easily get stoned every night and wake up fresh as a daisy.


So folks, the reality is that 'recreational drugs' is the new beer! The youth of today are simply doing what we did - they're just using something that most of us didn't, and the big worry is that they're using something that most of us don't understand. If we don't understand it - then we can't educate them on it.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

see i kinda call bulls*** to that Johny Member ... there is a perception that its a modern thing this taking drugs business the fact is drug use has been around forever i know friends of friends who in the 60's were taking all kinds of things in their down time - in the 80's drug use was pretty common ... the differance is now days with mass media and social media the drug use is put more infront of peoples face .... Rec drugs are not the new beer they are just more openely discussed than they were in the past

[Johnny Member]

But St Trav, those who did take drugs in the 60s were lablled as hippies and were on the fringe. The beer drinkers didn't relate.


Now, it's the norm.

I've played in sporting clubs, work in a corporate environment and have several circles of friends - and in all of those areas drug use is as common to most of them as a Friday night wine on the couch for me is.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

But St Trav, those who did take drugs in the 60s were lablled as hippies and were on the fringe. The beer drinkers didn't relate.


Now, it's the norm.

I've played in sporting clubs, work in a corporate environment and have several circles of friends - and in all of those areas drug use is as common to most of them as a Friday night wine on the couch for me is.

i would imagine if we had the internet , camera phones, Facebook Instagram ect in the 60's you would have found there were more than just the hippies taking drugs .. the hippies were just not hiding the fact .... in the 80's corporate drug use was rampant... now days its the norm because there is no hiding from it the media love reporting on it and it gives the impression of it being more common ...
its just like teen sex is believed to be more rampant these day the fact is every generation had the same issue just now days its not seen as such a taboo as it was say 30 years ago ..

i have had this conversation recently at a dinner party that had a great mix of generations there is a perception by the youth generation of today that they invented the party life style ... my generation look at that and laugh cause we know we were doing the same stuff in our youth , our parents generation laugh cause they know they were doing it too , their parents deny it but deep down they know it was going on in their day aswell

[plugger66]

People show their age, and ignorance to a degree, when talking about drugs.


Here's the deal:

Drugs can f*** you up really bad.

So can gambling.
So can drinking.
So can eating.
Hell, so can online gaming these days!

But none of the above categorically f*** you up.


Many, many people take drugs, and you would never even know it. They are responsible about it and know their limitations. Same with gambling, drinking and anything else.

The thing with drugs, is that they make you feel good. That's the point of them. If they made you feel s*** - no one would take them!


So when we tell kids "don't take drugs, they're bad!", and as part of being young they get curious and take them anyway - they feel good and instantly think that we don't know what the hell we're talking about! They have the time of their lives, and think that the old dudes who told them how bad drugs are must just be being kill joys.

The other thing with drugs, is that it's easier to take them regularly, which is a trap. If you got pissed every night, the hangovers alone would make you change your mind and pull back! But you can easily get stoned every night and wake up fresh as a daisy.


So folks, the reality is that 'recreational drugs' is the new beer! The youth of today are simply doing what we did - they're just using something that most of us didn't, and the big worry is that they're using something that most of us don't understand. If we don't understand it - then we can't educate them on it.

Recreational drugs the new beer. Well it certainly depends what drugs you use. Beer is $2 a can if you buy a slab. Ice is $150 for about 2 smokes or injections. Whatever you prefer. it is far from the new beer. it is dangerous addictive drug. I think a good parent can explain that drugs are bad even if you feel good for an hour. Anyway I am of the opinion if the tests help one person its more than would be helped without them.