GWS why?

[Moorabbin Man]

The success of the Western Sydney Wanderers in the A League has killed off GWS almost before they have started. Ironically WSW came about because the A League bit the bullet and got rid of the Gold Coast. The AFL will be too stupid to deal with reality and will no doubt bend over backwards to hand them a Premiership on a platter. Don't think that will even work, they should end up in Canberra full time.

[joffaboy]

Are TV ratings in NSW for footy any good? I reckon they would be average but I'm just guessing.

GWS v St.Kilda from Canberra at 4:40 on a Saturday afternoon would have rated its socks off in Sydney for Foxtel

[plugger66]

The success of the Western Sydney Wanderers in the A League has killed off GWS almost before they have started. Ironically WSW came about because the A League bit the bullet and got rid of the Gold Coast. The AFL will be too stupid to deal with reality and will no doubt bend over backwards to hand them a Premiership on a platter. Don't think that will even work, they should end up in Canberra full time.

Can you explain why a summer sport effects the footy? Im amazed footy has survived with cricket going on. And the soccer didnt get rid of the GC. GC got rid of the GC.

[SaintPav]

It's a two edged sword. The current TV rights deal underwrites 9 games a round for 5 years and underwrites the survival of the weaker clubs which includes us.

However, when the operator and regulator own two teams and change the rules as they go along to promote them (eg draft concessions etc) , it's going to p!ss traditional supporters off.

Are TV ratings in NSW for footy any good? I reckon they would be average but I'm just guessing.

I think they are terrible at the moment.

Well Dragit has a point if that is true. Swans have been there since 1982 and have won two flags but the ratings for Sydney games are still terrible.

[SaintPav]

Are TV ratings in NSW for footy any good? I reckon they would be average but I'm just guessing.

GWS v St.Kilda from Canberra at 4:40 on a Saturday afternoon would have rated its socks off in Sydney for Foxtel

I can just imagine. Weren't Foxtel giving subscriptions away in NSW at one stage?

[BigMart]

Why is anyone comparing NRL and AFL??

1/ they derive income from different means, and have a different supporter culture.

Again, those who have never lived in Sydney probably don't understand AFL's place up there, it is a niche market at best. I played for East Syney/NSW Uni for three years in the state league in a premiership team and prior to that in the NTFL in Tas. The competitions weren't comparable.point of that is to illustrate that there is not even grass roots footy there. 8 pages back in the per before you get an article, 5th story on the news for 10 seconds, and only on one team.

Many Tasmanians would disagree that they don't 'deserve' a team.... Only people who would suggest such rot, again, arrogant, ignorant and probably selfish.

Would immediately have more members than 10 current clubs, including ours.... Why do StK deserve a team??

Why did western Sydney deserve a team.... Because of its population??

I'd like to have seen the response if they decided to eliminate the two weakest teams in order to go into these markets without diluting the talent pool??

Yes 2.2 Million people
Most Who support
Parramatta, Penrith, Wests Tigers, NSW Warstahs, West Sydney Wanderers..... Without mentioning Cronulla, Cantebury, StGeorge, Manly, ACT Brumbies, East Sydney.... Sydney Kings, Illawarra Hawks, West Sydney....

Or are refugees, whose last priority is becoming a member of GWS Giants... They are more concerned with Education, employment and housing.

Does the AFL seriously believe they can walk into a Heartland and try to take over?!

More slice of the pie?? Sydney are still coming to terms with that after 30 years... And they were a relocation....

Greed is good! Someone once said

I like
Strength through loyalty...... Be loyal to those who love you, don't take them for granted and NEVER bite the hand that feeds you

Why does Tassie deserve a team.... 150 years of Loyal following, and production of more AFL superstars per captita than anywhere....

[dragit]

Cheers joff, I don't really like being called insular, but thinking about it... I probably am.

Just thinking about the money that effectively the other 16 clubs will be kicking in for these new franchises, all for the long term betterment of the game, but not doing much for the current established fans of the game.

It's so hard to win premierships as it is, I've now seen us blow three chances in my lifetime, now just starting to question how long it might be before we are in any position to challenge again. Watching 50 year business plan start-ups raffle the best 50 footballers over a few years just seems absurd sometimes. Weve now seen 11 flags go to teams that weren't in the comp when I started going to the footy, freo are firming & you can guarantee the 2 new clubs will have a few soon.

Great for the AFL in 2075 perhaps, but pretty farkn sheet for fans of small vic clubs.

[plugger66]

Why is anyone comparing NRL and AFL??

1/ they derive income from different means, and have a different supporter culture.

Again, those who have never lived in Sydney probably don't understand AFL's place up there, it is a niche market at best. I played for East Syney/NSW Uni for three years in the state league in a premiership team and prior to that in the NTFL in Tas. The competitions weren't comparable.point of that is to illustrate that there is not even grass roots footy there. 8 pages back in the per before you get an article, 5th story on the news for 10 seconds, and only on one team.

Many Tasmanians would disagree that they don't 'deserve' a team.... Only people who would suggest such rot, again, arrogant, ignorant and probably selfish.

Would immediately have more members than 10 current clubs, including ours.... Why do StK deserve a team??

Why did western Sydney deserve a team.... Because of its population??

I'd like to have seen the response if they decided to eliminate the two weakest teams in order to go into these markets without diluting the talent pool??

Yes 2.2 Million people
Most Who support
Parramatta, Penrith, Wests Tigers, NSW Warstahs, West Sydney Wanderers..... Without mentioning Cronulla, Cantebury, StGeorge, Manly, ACT Brumbies, East Sydney.... Sydney Kings, Illawarra Hawks, West Sydney....

Or are refugees, whose last priority is becoming a member of GWS Giants... They are more concerned with Education, employment and housing.

Does the AFL seriously believe they can walk into a Heartland and try to take over?!

More slice of the pie?? Sydney are still coming to terms with that after 30 years... And they were a relocation....

Greed is good! Someone once said

I like
Strength through loyalty...... Be loyal to those who love you, don't take them for granted and NEVER bite the hand that feeds you

Why does Tassie deserve a team.... 150 years of Loyal following, and production of more AFL superstars per captita than anywhere....

Intersting way of not answering my threads. Why dont you put me on the foe list instead of calling people who disagree arrogant ignorant or selfish. And im glad we found out where you played. Not sure that has anything to do with either state at this stage. And as you come from tassie it sounds like you are being selfish wanting a side there now. And by the way dont think everyone is comparing NRL to AFL. some are just explaing why memberships arent the be all in Sydney. I take you lived in Sydney in the last 5 to 10 years.

[BigMart]

BTW

I was devastated for the tens of thousands of Tasmanian StK fans who were shunned by the very club Tasmanian players helped to create its only successful era.

It was a gutless, weak minded decision and demonstrated the difference between Hawthorn and StK.

The performance argument was hilarious... Seriously.

I live in Melbourne, but would have easily sacrificed 1-2 games out of the 17 Melbourne games I am able to see, so they would get to see their beloved club. Luckily for StK Tas fans whilst being shattered are loyal to the core and never jump off. StK fans in Tassie was like a StK fans bayside in Melbourne.... Everywhere....
Hawthorn will win the next generation though...

[BigMart]

Thanks Dragit for creating this thread?!

Love this debate, it is probably the topic I am most passionate about.

It's like turning ones back on a loyal and trusted friend that has been there for you, and wanting to be friends with a person you don't know because you think they can make you rich!

I feel for my fellow taswegions, I am a proud Tasmanian and know what AFL means to people there.

More than it did to Israel Folau

[rexy]

I'd like to see a side in Tassie, I would think that with sensible management they could be financially viable, might be concerns over drafted players wanting to leave after first contract due to small town etc but probably not much harder than Adelaide do it? Some I have spoken to believe that the North South divide in Tas would mean you could only really attract half of the state to support any club depending on where their base is? Don't mind the league trying to grow into new markets, just concerned that GWS has a very low start off field!

[SaintPav]

If you have a team in Tassie the AFL will be cannibalising its own market as they already have half a team there. Victorian clubs need to keep their existing market as Melbourne is too small.

[BigMart]

In an AFL

Why are s*** Victorian clubs more sustainable or worthy of a license?!

And
AFL needs to be concerned about the strength of football, not clubs...

Even so
Each Vic club would lose between 1-3000 members possibly? With the into of a Tas team

Not many of the supporter base in Tas are paid up AFL club members... Why would they be... They can't exactly catch a train to a game... Some do get interstate membership packages of like 1-2 game entry for 50 bucks or something...

And Hawthorn... Cry me a river for them, they have 60000 members

[Old Mate]

The AFL's priority is money over loyalty....As is society these days. Sad but true.

[maverick]

Couple of things SP

Why does the AFL need to find 'new markets' is the game struggling??

Consolidation of the brand, before expansion.... The game is not even entrenched in the north, but we think by chucking two unsuccessful Mickey Mouse teams in there, is going to harbour more support...

Most businesses that fold, are ones that are not happy being successful and get greedy

Anyone who has lived in NSW would know, and I lived in coogee for 3 years..... Knows footy is about as relevant as the storm

Not sure why AFL has to grow to become the biggest sport in the world and take over Rugby (won't happen north of the border) only arrogance and ignorance of Sydney would

I hope (know) these ventures are pathetic, which is good for StK but I am Sad my home state has copped it in the arse from arrogant, greedy power trippers that want to leave a legacy.

How do you know why businesses fail, do you teach that?
I didn't realise the afl wanted to take over Nrl, I thought thy just wanted to compete and gain a foot hold.
The swans need a derby, that's true tribal success, same for Brisbane.

The afl is spoken about as the best run code in the land or a reason, it's certainly not greed or power tripping.
The Nrl are second rate in comparison, their treatment of melbourne storm is disgraceful.

St kilda has grown and rebuilt under the afl, if the vfl still existed I don't think we would have.
They have my support in this business venture.
I just wish north had of relocated to the Gold Coast, it would have saved them in the long run.

[Cairnsman]

I reckon Cairns will get a Team before Tasmania does.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/more-ne ... 6579576627

[dragit]

I reckon Cairns will get a Team before Tasmania does.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/more-ne ... 6579576627

North Melbourne Cairnsgaroos

[lloyd21]

Lived & worked in Tasmania and they can not sustain a team all the big sponsors are located on the mainland.The state of football in Tasmania has major issues the north of the state league hate the southern league and vice versa they don't get on.
Afl is a TV game ,sponsors are only interested in getting their product on Tv ,while pay tv (Fox ) grows the game will flourish.
Tasmanians luv football but they have no large industries that are prepared to spend money in the Afl, but the home city of the networks is Sydney, the corporate $ keeps football alive not the guy in the outer,look at the Eagles $40 million from the miners alone each year .

[BigMart]

No, I don't teach business... But it is pretty common knowledge.... Greed causes bankruptcy in many cases...

Best supported..... Not best run.... Uneven draw, uneven playing field, continual dramas, continual strange decisions....

The AFL is the goose that lays the golden egg! It is an appealing game to the most sports fanatical fans in Australia... Really AD could do anything he wanted and the game would prosper...

And it prosper through the hand outs to these joke franchises... Even suffer through any fleeting successes they have. But at the end of the day.... Do these franchises improve footy? They bring more money, here was I thinking it cost 250 million to get them up

[bergholt]

No, I don't teach business... But it is pretty common knowledge.... Greed causes bankruptcy in many cases...

Many but by no means most.

Small businesses might fail because of greed. Most large businesses which fail do so because of technological change which invalidates their business model - big businesses have too much inertia to change direction quick enough. Look at Kodak, blindsided and wrecked by digital photography. Look at the newspapers, free-to-air TV and magazines, relying on an advertising dollar which has moved to the internet. A million other examples.

[asiu]

yep.
... leaving tas was dumb dumb and then some.

idiotic decision.

tasmanians make great stkilda supporters ... we will stick fat regardless of how hopeless we are ... its our nature to fight on against the odds.

... but now , (through exposure) the young uns are dawkers.

dreadful decision.
possible deathknell decision.

[joffaboy]

Tasmania couldn't even support a basketball team let alone an AFL team.

Every tasmanian already has an AFL team so it would fail disasterously.

As well as that it only has 350k people. The Western suburbs of Melbourne deserve another AFl team before Tasmania.

Only biased people with no commercial acumen or any long term vision would favour a dying aging tiny population to one 8 times larger.

The AFL is many thingsand has many failings but financially irresponsible and failure to strategic plan are not two of the failings.

Do you people honestly think the AFL didn't stratagise, plan and analyse the expansion of GWS and GC.

Heard it all before from inward looking supporters - relocating the Swans will never work, an AFL team in Brisbane? Rubbish. Expanding the AFL to Western Australia and South Australia - will be the death of local football and of at least 6 Vic clubs.

Tasmania is backward looking. You dont automatically "deserve" an AFL team because of location or you are nominally an AFL state.

This is about the long term survival of a regional little game in far off Australia that is supported by the less populated states of a country with a tiny population. There is no international presence. This competition from RL, an international top heavy Rugby Union and the giant that is world soccer.

The AFl has a duty to the game, not to individual clubs or their supporters. It certainly doesn't have any duty to some backwater like Tasmania.

[BigMart]

Why do people automatically assume a Tas Team has to have a Tas sponsorship base??

However, Boags, Cascade, Cadbury, Tas seafood, Gunns, McCains... Are just a few reasonably sized companies in Tas

Not sure any interstate team has a locally grown main sponsor.

In 2010 Mars committed a huge sponsorship dollar to a Tasmanian bid....

Skoda.... Are they based in Blactown??

[bergholt]

Why do people automatically assume a Tas Team has to have a Tas sponsorship base??

A big part of corporate revenue is from corporate boxes. They're not as attractive if you have to get on a plane just to get to them.

[Cairnsman]

No, I don't teach business... But it is pretty common knowledge.... Greed causes bankruptcy in many cases...

Best supported..... Not best run.... Uneven draw, uneven playing field, continual dramas, continual strange decisions....

The AFL is the goose that lays the golden egg! It is an appealing game to the most sports fanatical fans in Australia... Really AD could do anything he wanted and the game would prosper...

And it prosper through the hand outs to these joke franchises... Even suffer through any fleeting successes they have. But at the end of the day.... Do these franchises improve footy? They bring more money, here was I thinking it cost 250 million to get them up

I would have thought bad management causes bankruptcy. The national expansion has improved footy. The proof is there for all to see. Do the franchises improve footy? Time will tell but based on the AFLs track record you would have to say yes. I enjoy watching AFL and the new teams really get on telly a lot up North so it gives footy lovers a lot more to watch. As you say it is an appealing game and it's fair to say that Western Sydney may just get the bug.