The Moment I Saw

[stinger]

For what it's worth
Lyon NOT highly regarded by administrative and support staff at St. Kilda fc, not a lot of sadness at his departure!

interesting comment....

[BigMart]

Good point Joffa

The Ross Lyon game plan was a very good one for consistency and winning... It relied less on match winners and more on 22 players doing there role....

It was almost impossible for a team with less talent to beat StK in that period, as we had better players and a better game plan.... And it also kept us in striking distance of any team playing better and when momentum swung we could capitalise.... We choked teams until the surrendered...

What we rarely did was drill team, or allow Individuals to express their talents outside structure which inhibited some.... We also had our most dominant player competing with 2/3 players in the hope he could succeed, so we had 2/3 helping the backs so they would succeed..... Imagine if Nick was allowed to be one out in that time... He would have dominated even more so, but we would have surrendered more...

We had match winner like Coll, Geelong.... But, if their match winners burned and got a too far ahead, our GP was such that we could not offensively bridge the gap....

Except in the second half of 2010.... When he rolled the dice and Goddard didn't sit behind the ball and direct traffic and cut loose, Hayes just hunted the footy, and a defensive mechanism Gilbert was released....

We did not capitalise in 2009, should have been 8 in front at HT such was our dominance

Was/is he a good coach
Yes!

Malthouse and Clarkson are better... They have a better balance of team footy, and allowing talent to surface (which breeds confidence in individuals)

Very poor developer of individual talent. Good team strategist/leader

Until Sandilands went down, he had a good chance in the next two years.... Sandilands will never fully recover from that and he is their most critical player by a mile....

[noob]

I must admit Freo looked very good near the end of the season. Took a couple of years for st.kilda to get better and you could see the dockers improve as the season went on.

[Old Mate]

How will the Freo board and fans react if they miss the finals this year....

[whiskers3614]

How will the Freo board and fans react if they miss the finals this year....

doesn't matter how, he still gets his $$$$

[stinger]

How will the Freo board and fans react if they miss the finals this year....

doesn't matter how, he still gets his $$$$

and maybe the chop.....if they miss out on the top 4...

..if pav goes down as well...they will probably miss out on the top 8

[Old Mate]

Point I was making is there is no coach under as much pressure to succeed.

[BigMart]

Mick Malthouse

Buckley was last year

James Hird

[gringo]

My Richmond supporter mate who is very involved in footy always claimed Lyon was a poor coach as he used a very one trick style and played to mitigate losing rather than winning. The same technique snuck a premiership over west coast at sydney. He thinks that there is more merit in getting on the front foot and gunning for a win. I think Ross has become a more attacking coach with Freo. he claimed after the 09 GF that Ross would never coach a premiership and then clarified that he might pinch one but not win one. I always defended the style as it got us close and probably think he will snag one eventually.

[stinger]

Point I was making is there is no coach under as much pressure to succeed.

couldn't happen to a bigger prick....

[BigMart]

Not sure if a Richmond person would know a successful coach if they had one?!

Can't sneak a premiership

You need one

[gringo]

Not sure if a Richmond person would know a successful coach if they had one?!

Can't sneak a premiership

You need one

I think it's a pretty common perception of the Lyon style when he was at the Saints and also of Sydney at the time. It was seen as hyper-defensive and giving an equal chance to lesser players. Some even used to accuse the Saints and Swans of playing outside the spirit of the game. I liked what he did at Freo last year and he seems to have got some pace and skill that doesn't have as much reliance on solid foot soldiers. At the end of the day a lot will depend on his list and their fitness. He can either make a silk purse from a sows ear or he can drag gifted lists close to the prize- time will tell.

[BigMart]

Tongue in cheek.

The defensive game plan has its drawbacks

So did GTs offensive GP

Striking a balance is very difficult...... Most successful teams have 2/3 components in order

Dominant teams have all three

[The Redeemer]

But I reckon the biggest problem with Ross Lyon is not that he is a bad bloke but he is a coach who only knows how to come second. He will never coach the Fremantle Dockers to a premiership IMO in the same way he was never going to deliver with the Saints.

He just doesn't have it in him to coach an AFL team to a premiership.

What unmittigated revisionist garbage.

What complete and utter bollocks.

Heres a hint Einstein. 7.7 to 7.1 in GF v Geelong halftime. If the players could kick straight, if Milne, running into an open goal from 30 metres out shanks it and dribbles it along the ground, if Schneider misses an open goal 10 metres out right in front, if Clarke doesn't get run down from behind, costing us a sham goal, we would have won easily.

Once again a simpleton lets the players off the hook.

2010 - we, like everyone else in the comp, are getting flogged by Collingwood in the GF. Four goals down at halftime and we could have been 8. Lyon throws Blake and Kosi in the ruck, Ray onto Swan, Gilbo up forward and if not for the bounce of the ball in the final minute we would have won it from nowhere.

I hate this simpletons proclimations three years after the event.

Where was this wonderful analysis after we won 19 in a row? After Roo went down for three months and we still got to the big dance?

Just a fluke? We didn't have a coach? What complete and utter GARBAGE.

Stupid, ignorant, banal, vacuous TRIPE.

Just incredibly embarrassing and dumb

Agreed.

The initial poster types out a bunch of baloney as if we were a bottom 4 side for the period of Lyon's reign.

If we had so many flaws then how come we made Grand Finals?

[gringo]

Tongue in cheek.

The defensive game plan has its drawbacks

So did GTs offensive GP

Striking a balance is very difficult...... Most successful teams have 2/3 components in order

Dominant teams have all three

Offensive and defensive game plans are alternately in and out of fashion. GT was still really unlucky with injuries at the wrong times and probably like Lyon could have claims on nearly climbing the mountain. GT walked away so we can't come back with any evidence of his superior coaching based on what he did elsewhere.

Going the lockdown defensive game is now like wearing flared trousers - you would be metaphorically beaten by the AFL equivalent of some Brunswick street hipster in skinny jeans for doing it now.

[BigMart]

Very correct.

Only two things that remain a constant

Win the tackles and contested ball... Win the game... Regardless of style

[dragit]

Very correct.

Only two things that remain a constant

Win the tackles and contested ball... Win the game... Regardless of style

Pretty sure we won both of those stats against fremantle last year, but lost the game… Actually I seem to recall you writing at the time that clearance/contested ball was an over-rated stat?

[plugger66]

Very correct.

Only two things that remain a constant

Win the tackles and contested ball... Win the game... Regardless of style

Pretty sure we won both of those stats against fremantle last year, but lost the game… Actually I seem to recall you writing at the time that clearance/contested ball was an over-rated stat?

He only writes that when it suits him. Like me he talks s*** more than most. The problem is he believes everything he says even if it contradicts a previous post of his.

[gringo]

Very correct.

Only two things that remain a constant

Win the tackles and contested ball... Win the game... Regardless of style

Pretty sure we won both of those stats against fremantle last year, but lost the game… Actually I seem to recall you writing at the time that clearance/contested ball was an over-rated stat?

He only writes that when it suits him. Like me he talks s*** more than most. The problem is he believes everything he says even if it contradicts a previous post of his.

Jesus guys this place would shut down if we all stopped contradicting ourselves from previous posts. Some days I can be philosophical about losing Lyon then he wins a game and I hate him again. I just hope no one remembers the s*** I have posted in the past, the problem with forums is you speak off the cuff not with any real basis. You would sit and read proper journos if you wanted all the facts ticked off...

[plugger66]

Pretty sure we won both of those stats against fremantle last year, but lost the game… Actually I seem to recall you writing at the time that clearance/contested ball was an over-rated stat?

He only writes that when it suits him. Like me he talks s*** more than most. The problem is he believes everything he says even if it contradicts a previous post of his.

Jesus guys this place would shut down if we all stopped contradicting ourselves from previous posts. Some days I can be philosophical about losing Lyon then he wins a game and I hate him again. I just hope no one remembers the s*** I have posted in the past, the problem with forums is you speak off the cuff not with any real basis. You would sit and read proper journos if you wanted all the facts ticked off...

So true as long as can acknowledge we dont know it all.

[dragit]

Most of us don't strut around like we invented footy… passing off opinion as sagely footy truths or hindsights & captain obvious' as prophetic wisdom.

[SaintPav]

Jesus guys this place would shut down if we all stopped contradicting ourselves from previous posts. Some days I can be philosophical about losing Lyon then he wins a game and I hate him again. I just hope no one remembers the s*** I have posted in the past, the problem with forums is you speak off the cuff not with any real basis. You would sit and read proper journos if you wanted all the facts ticked off...

I agree with everything you said until I read your last sentence. There's no such thing as a proper journo and most people on here know a lot more about the Saints than any journo I know.

[BigMart]

Drag it....

Get over it... And relax a bit.... If I raise your ire that much, just ignore...

No I didn't invent footy, just like you, but I can have a f*** ing opinion like everyone else... Including you!

That's all this place is for, supporters giving an opinion and/or debating it. One poster refuses to concede on any of mine... That's fine, his prerogative.... You are just being silly really.... Maybe you and plugger66 can stalk me together, since you loathe a person you have never met so much.... Or perhaps not take it (or me) too seriously?!

Here is a general statement

Generally teams who win the contested ball and tackling... Win the game....

Is that statement allowed

To make it certain, teams who win the ball, use it well and out tackle the opposition will definitely win. Regardless of GP

Good enough for you??????

[gringo]

Jesus guys this place would shut down if we all stopped contradicting ourselves from previous posts. Some days I can be philosophical about losing Lyon then he wins a game and I hate him again. I just hope no one remembers the s*** I have posted in the past, the problem with forums is you speak off the cuff not with any real basis. You would sit and read proper journos if you wanted all the facts ticked off...

I agree with everything you said until I read your last sentence. There's no such thing as a proper journo and most people on here know a lot more about the Saints than any journo I know.

I was amusing myself with that statement.

[SaintPav]

Jesus guys this place would shut down if we all stopped contradicting ourselves from previous posts. Some days I can be philosophical about losing Lyon then he wins a game and I hate him again. I just hope no one remembers the s*** I have posted in the past, the problem with forums is you speak off the cuff not with any real basis. You would sit and read proper journos if you wanted all the facts ticked off...

I agree with everything you said until I read your last sentence. There's no such thing as a proper journo and most people on here know a lot more about the Saints than any journo I know.

I was amusing myself with that statement.

I like it.