Selection disection

[older saint]

I deliberately waited a while before throwing my 2 bits worth in ( for what they are worth, very little), but it appears to me that this game was list by playing injured players and Waters having a poor game ( rookie coach he will learn more from this than a win like Sydney game).

Stanley was clearly rushed back, Roo was not fit, Kosi clearly something wrong there. Jones while form has been average his record v harvey is excemplery and keeps him for around 10 posessions, Siposs was good v Adelaide yet gets dropped, Wells is the one North player who must be tagged and as heis the only one with real pace and breaks lines through the middle - wasn't.

Selection and match committee have a lit to answer for for this loss, as much as the undiscipline rubbish form a number of players, some repeat offenders (44).

Where to from here , time for tough decisions forget reputations and reward form and effort. We need a tall defender , perhaps he is not ready by Fergusson should come in with Blake out. Siposs in for Kosi - if not inj then needs to go to the 2s and find the ball, Wilkes ( as long as not let near the back line)for Roo- he is not fit, or even close, Jones in - we need a tagger we do not have Colingwoods mids that we can play without one, Ray's form deserves a chance also. Saad, Milne, Milera, Schnieder - 1 too many at this stage as none have the tank to go through the middle. What has happened to Cripps, Newness who provided some run and kicking skill off half back.

Usual suspects such as Clarke will cop critisism for getting run down by Harvey but his courage a number of times going back with tha ball was impressive

Perhaps next week:

B: Geary , Gwilt, Fergusson
HB:Clarke, Fisher, Dempster
c: Montagna, Hayes, Steven
HF: Schneder, Siposs, Goddard
F: Milne, Wilkes, Saad
Foll: McEvoy, Dal, Armitage
Int: Jones, Gilbert, Ray, Gram

Out: Kosi , Roo, Stanley, Blake (all Inj) Milera

In: Fergusson, Jones, Ray, Wilkes, Siposs

If Goddard gets Suspended after Scott dobbed him in ( not talking about other players though) then perhaps another runner with Cripps?

[mad saint guy]

I think that team would be absolutely slaughtered by Essendon offensively and defensively. Ferguson is a lean, running defender in the Gilbert mould - not the answer to our problems. You also don't drop three key forwards and bring only one in, leaving McEvoy with the entire ruck load.

I agree Kosi has been shocking for a few weeks now and Roo doesn't look fit, but we need at least one of them. I'm going to assume Roo is fitter than Kosi for now. Clarke has amazing courage but the number of times he flew in for the spoil and took out another saints player was shocking. He gives everything but I feel like a smarter, more composed player would be more effective in that role. Milera has been ordinary for over a month and needs to find form in the VFL. Blake may not be 100% but with Kosi struggling and Stanley likely injured he needs to pinch hit in the ruck.Ray gets in the side ahead of Jones as a run with player IMO.

OUT: Kosi (rest), Stanley (hamstring), Milera, Clarke
IN: Wilkes, Siposs, Ray, Simpkin

B: Gwilt, Simpkin, Geary
HB: Fisher, Gilbert, Dempster
C: Montagna, Hayes, Goddard
HF: Schneider, Riewoldt, Siposs
F: Milne, Wilkes, Saad

Foll: McEvoy, Dal Santo, Steven
Int: Ray, Armitage, Blake, Gram (sub)

[SainterK]

With Blake and Stanley likely out, Kosi gets a reprieve surely?

[saintbrat]

ferguson still a rookie- so unless Blake is going out for 6-8 with an ankle he can't play.

[magnifisaint]

ferguson still a rookie- so unless Blake is going out for 6-8 with an ankle he can't play.

Why don't people take any notice. Ferguson needs to be upgraded before he can play

[mad saint guy]

With Blake and Stanley likely out, Kosi gets a reprieve surely?

Depends on the severity of the injuries. I'm a long-time Kosi fan but he was an absolute liability yesterday, both forward and in the ruck. If either Blake or Stanley are fit they'd be a better option as backup ruckman.

[plugger66]

Why do people think Watters is suddenly going to make up to 5 changes when we havent looked like it all year especially as Sandy have been ordinary lately so that suggests Saints players are struggling. People see a loss and think guys thay probably never see are going to be better even though some even struggle in a much lower standard than the guys in the AFL. They then get a chance and the same people say they are not good enough.

[Richter]

If we go to 6-9 then we would need to win at least 6 out of our final 8 to get to finals.... Seems to me that these guys have two more games to prove that this season is not a total write-off.... if, as expected we lose these two games then... I say....

GO THE TANK.....

[plugger66]

If we go to 6-9 then we would need to win at least 6 out of our final 8 to get to finals.... Seems to me that these guys have two more games to prove that this season is not a total write-off.... if, as expected we lose these two games then... I say....

GO THE TANK.....

What and finish 12th instead of 10th. Not sure that will help to much when drafting but it may effect our membership next season.

[maverick]

If we go to 6-9 then we would need to win at least 6 out of our final 8 to get to finals.... Seems to me that these guys have two more games to prove that this season is not a total write-off.... if, as expected we lose these two games then... I say....

GO THE TANK.....

What and finish 12th instead of 10th. Not sure that will help to much when drafting but it may effect our membership next season.

I actually think the opposite.
It made a massive difference in 2006 when the Cats snagged Selwood, two places ahead of us.
Getting a more highly touted player because of draft position (possibly) will bring more people into membership than a lame run at the end and finishing two or three ladder positions up and still missing finals. Selling hope is what is required.

[8856brother]

Why do people think Watters is suddenly going to make up to 5 changes when we havent looked like it all year especially as Sandy have been ordinary lately so that suggests Saints players are struggling. People see a loss and think guys thay probably never see are going to be better even though some even struggle in a much lower standard than the guys in the AFL. They then get a chance and the same people say they are not good enough.

Injuries and suspension will cover probably 3 changes. That's without even making any changes due to form. I would think 5 changes isn't out of the question.

[Buckets]

Why do people think Watters is suddenly going to make up to 5 changes when we havent looked like it all year especially as Sandy have been ordinary lately so that suggests Saints players are struggling. People see a loss and think guys thay probably never see are going to be better even though some even struggle in a much lower standard than the guys in the AFL. They then get a chance and the same people say they are not good enough.

Injuries and suspension will cover probably 3 changes. That's without even making any changes due to form. I would think 5 changes isn't out of the question.

Well we have 3 out at this stage.

Bj
Blake
Stanley

If we were to go for another 2 out it IMO would have to be out of

Gram
Kosi
Raph

So to bring in 5

Newnes
Dunnell
Cripps
Ledger
Markworth
Ray
Ross
Wilkes
Simpkin


Out of the above who do we bring in?

[bigcarl]

Why do people think Watters is suddenly going to make up to 5 changes when we havent looked like it all year especially as Sandy have been ordinary lately so that suggests Saints players are struggling. People see a loss and think guys thay probably never see are going to be better even though some even struggle in a much lower standard than the guys in the AFL. They then get a chance and the same people say they are not good enough.

Injuries and suspension will cover probably 3 changes. That's without even making any changes due to form. I would think 5 changes isn't out of the question.

Well we have 3 out at this stage.

Bj
Blake
Stanley

If we were to go for another 2 out it IMO would have to be out of

Gram
Kosi
Raph

So to bring in 5

Newnes
Dunnell
Cripps
Ledger
Markworth
Ray
Ross
Wilkes
Simpkin


Out of the above who do we bring in?

Sippos?

[Con Gorozidis]

If we go to 6-9 then we would need to win at least 6 out of our final 8 to get to finals.... Seems to me that these guys have two more games to prove that this season is not a total write-off.... if, as expected we lose these two games then... I say....

GO THE TANK.....

What and finish 12th instead of 10th. Not sure that will help to much when drafting but it may effect our membership next season.

I actually think the opposite.
It made a massive difference in 2006 when the Cats snagged Selwood, two places ahead of us.
Getting a more highly touted player because of draft position (possibly) will bring more people into membership than a lame run at the end and finishing two or three ladder positions up and still missing finals. Selling hope is what is required.

Im with you Maverick. Footy clubs in the business of selling hope. And in those long 6 months post season none of is will remember if we finished 10th or 14th. But we will be looking fwd to the draft and we will be looking fwd to seeing some high draft picks and maybe a young gun recruit on our list come December.
So I think we should get games in to kids. And move some older blokes on. The Board should give Scotty the backing and confidence to do it.

[bergholt]

ferguson still a rookie- so unless Blake is going out for 6-8 with an ankle he can't play.

Why don't people take any notice. Ferguson needs to be upgraded before he can play

from the middle of the season each club has a free rookie upgrade, so no long term injury would be required if we wanted to play ferguson or curren or dunell.

[samuraisaint]

Why do people think Watters is suddenly going to make up to 5 changes when we havent looked like it all year especially as Sandy have been ordinary lately so that suggests Saints players are struggling. People see a loss and think guys thay probably never see are going to be better even though some even struggle in a much lower standard than the guys in the AFL. They then get a chance and the same people say they are not good enough.

How do you know that the OP hasn't seen the players he/she is talking about - especially when you yourself said in another thread that you weren't at the match last night either?

[bobmurray]

I deliberately waited a while before throwing my 2 bits worth in ( for what they are worth, very little), but it appears to me that this game was list by playing injured players and Waters having a poor game ( rookie coach he will learn more from this than a win like Sydney game).

Stanley was clearly rushed back, Roo was not fit, Kosi clearly something wrong there. Jones while form has been average his record v harvey is excemplery and keeps him for around 10 posessions, Siposs was good v Adelaide yet gets dropped, Wells is the one North player who must be tagged and as heis the only one with real pace and breaks lines through the middle - wasn't.

Selection and match committee have a lit to answer for for this loss, as much as the undiscipline rubbish form a number of players, some repeat offenders (44).

Where to from here , time for tough decisions forget reputations and reward form and effort. We need a tall defender , perhaps he is not ready by Fergusson should come in with Blake out. Siposs in for Kosi - if not inj then needs to go to the 2s and find the ball, Wilkes ( as long as not let near the back line)for Roo- he is not fit, or even close, Jones in - we need a tagger we do not have Colingwoods mids that we can play without one, Ray's form deserves a chance also. Saad, Milne, Milera, Schnieder - 1 too many at this stage as none have the tank to go through the middle. What has happened to Cripps, Newness who provided some run and kicking skill off half back.

Usual suspects such as Clarke will cop critisism for getting run down by Harvey but his courage a number of times going back with tha ball was impressive

Perhaps next week:

B: Geary , Gwilt, Fergusson
HB:Clarke, Fisher, Dempster
c: Montagna, Hayes, Steven
HF: Schneder, Siposs, Goddard
F: Milne, Wilkes, Saad
Foll: McEvoy, Dal, Armitage
Int: Jones, Gilbert, Ray, Gram

Out: Kosi , Roo, Stanley, Blake (all Inj) Milera

In: Fergusson, Jones, Ray, Wilkes, Siposs

If Goddard gets Suspended after Scott dobbed him in ( not talking about other players though) then perhaps another runner with Cripps?

Hopefully we can get within 100 points with that squad...

[Buckets]

Bigcarl, my error Sippos was left out and he should be in the mix as well.

[ShanghaiSaint]

So to bring in 5

Newnes
Dunnell
Cripps
Ledger
Markworth
Ray
Ross
Wilkes
Simpkin


Out of the above who do we bring in?

Heard on the radio Kosi was sick and vomiting during the match, not that i saw it. so this might be a reason for his game. Gram won't get dropped that's for sure. Clarke maybe...

Out of that five I would have Cripps Ray Sippos and Simpkin why no Sippos on your list?

[cwrcyn]

Out: Blake (inj) Goddard (Susp) Stanley (inj) Milera, Gram

In: Siposs, Jones, Peake, Ray, Simpkin


Kosi survives only because Blake is injured.


We lacked run yesterday, and the ins should assist. As crap a kick Jones is, he's quick and runs hard all day, and he can release Dempster to defense, where he's played so well this season. Simpkin has to play in Blake's absence.




.

[Ralphy]

Ross to play against his cousin jobe watson!

[8856brother]

Confirmed now that there will be a min 3 changes. 2 injuries, 1 susp

[older saint]

Interesting that the suggestion of dropping players injured or who haven't performed for weeks now (Kosi) and Roo ( injured clearly - do you keep driving a ferrari when it has a rattle?) gets a caning, and of course the usual drop Gram/ Clarke/ etc comes in. All good this is what makes this place interesting - different opinions.

Out : Stanley, Blake, Goddard - Definite

Kosi must be dropped he hasnt been near it and is either inj or terribly our of form . Not a huge fan of Wilkes but what message does it send that a player can keep doing nothing on the field and another keep performing albeit a lower level and not get a chance.

Siposs / Simpkin ( I forgot him in OP ) and would like to see Fergusson ( yes have seen him play)

Reality the way we played and the way Ess are playing if we get within 5 goals it will be a good effort.

[nobhead]

Why do people think Watters is suddenly going to make up to 5 changes when we havent looked like it all year especially as Sandy have been ordinary lately so that suggests Saints players are struggling. People see a loss and think guys thay probably never see are going to be better even though some even struggle in a much lower standard than the guys in the AFL. They then get a chance and the same people say they are not good enough.

Injuries and suspension will cover probably 3 changes. That's without even making any changes due to form. I would think 5 changes isn't out of the question.

Well we have 3 out at this stage.

Bj
Blake
Stanley

If we were to go for another 2 out it IMO would have to be out of

Gram
Kosi
Raph

So to bring in 5

Newnes
Dunnell
Cripps
Ledger
Markworth
Ray
Ross
Wilkes
Simpkin


Out of the above who do we bring in?

out
bj
stanley
blake
clarke
in
ray
sippos
simpkin
markworth

[Teflon]

Out: Blake (inj) Goddard (Susp) Stanley (inj) Milera, Gram

In: Siposs, Jones, Peake, Ray, Simpkin


Kosi survives only because Blake is injured.


We lacked run yesterday, and the ins should assist. As crap a kick Jones is, he's quick and runs hard all day, and he can release Dempster to defense, where he's played so well this season. Simpkin has to play in Blake's absence.


.

swap Peake for Ledger and Im in - Ledger can run AND wins his own ball while Peake thinks about it. Peakes finished at this level.