Expansive Watters on SEN

[Teflon]

So your happy with mediocre.... OK... That is better than terrible I suppose.

I'm not so happy with the side being average

careful Marto....Buckets will be along to tell you you're not being positive enough about honourable losses...

[Buckets]

So your happy with mediocre.... OK... That is better than terrible I suppose.

I'm not so happy with the side being average

careful Marto....Buckets will be along to tell you you're not being positive enough about honourable losses...

Ha and you accuse me of petty and pathetic...maybe you really do need to look in the mirror.

Normally read your posts and find them to be very balanced. This weekend however not so.

[defacto]

is that second link working?

[saintbrat]

is that second link working?

no

[magnifisaint]

is that second link working?

no

It feels walking out of the footy at half time

[saintbrat]

I suggest emailing
enquiries@sen.com.au
or

production@sen.com.au

or
footy@sen.com.au

or sms - although never sure that gets to the tech guys.
indicating this link is broken
http://www.sen.com.au/audioplayer/Audio ... rt-2)/4932

[Teflon]

So your happy with mediocre.... OK... That is better than terrible I suppose.

I'm not so happy with the side being average

careful Marto....Buckets will be along to tell you you're not being positive enough about honourable losses...

Ha and you accuse me of petty and pathetic...maybe you really do need to look in the mirror.

Normally read your posts and find them to be very balanced. This weekend however not so.

Odd as Ive not noticed you before till you started sniping other posters for an opinion that is FOOTBALL related....still it gives an insight into the individual...

[Buckets]

Odd Teflon as you and I have discussed football in the past without the need to lower our colours.

Then again I don't come on here to be a pest. I come on here for discussion.

[Teflon]

Odd Teflon as you and I have discussed football in the past without the need to lower our colours.

Then again I don't come on here to be a pest. I come on here for discussion.

We have Buckets and emotions aside I only come here to discuss football - I dont appreciate the "hes B4Eva" jibe when I post my views on how we played on Friday. Fair enough if you dont agree with me - but I hadnt and havent resorted to any personal comments on you to win favour, I truly see no need.

[Buckets]

Odd Teflon as you and I have discussed football in the past without the need to lower our colours.

Then again I don't come on here to be a pest. I come on here for discussion.

We have Buckets and emotions aside I only come here to discuss football - I dont appreciate the "hes B4Eva" jibe when I post my views on how we played on Friday. Fair enough if you dont agree with me - but I hadnt and havent resorted to any personal comments on you to win favour, I truly see no need.

And for my part I must apologise as my frustrations got the best of me.

Please don't think that I am not disappointed over Friday's loss, trust me I'm lucky I was at a mate's place as I think my plasma may have needed repairing! But the thing that struck me was the fact that I got this strange feeling watching them nearly pinch it, was that they believe that no matter how far behind they are they believe that they can get back in the game. The most frustrating thing for me over the last few years had been when we fell behind we stilled played safe and didn't dare to risk losing by more, they tried to stem the damage as such.

This year is different, no matter how far behind they get they will stop playing safe. I believe that Watters will give it to the playing group for getting themselves in to that position in the first place and so he should. But like any match this year while there has been negatives, there has been positives.

[Teflon]

Certainly agree we are not afraid to take some risk this year and thats a good thing and I do like what Watters is trying to do - I guess my frustration is all from allowing ourselves to get into such a predicament in the first place and then seeing crunch goals that just have to be kicked, yet again missed by the same culprits.

Siposs, Schneider, Dal allpositives and Riewoldt tried hard but gee....we let a massive opportunity slip.

[Moods]

Why if anyone expresses any sort of satisfaction with the way the boys fought out the game on Friday night (against a top 4 team interstate mind you) do some on here immediately assume that everyone is satisfied with the loss? In every game there has to be a winner and a loser. Sometimes how you lose actually defines you. Top teams rarely get thumped, they are always in the game. The fact that we have been in the game against the very best teams in no way diminishes my disappointment at the loss. A text msg I sent to a mate after the game sums up my feelings when he told me that it was a great game and he thought the saints look far better this year, I said - 'bloody shattered. A game we should have won. Just missed so many easy shots at goal.'

I don't consider myself an apologist, more a realist. I was prepared for the team to not be great this year. I am pleasantly surprised. They aren't great but they're certainly not terrible.

There is two ways you can look at a game of footy after a loss. i) We are bloody awful, insipid, and will be lucky to beat anyone the way we are playing at the moment. OR ii) We had a crack, but we weren't good enough BUT we are a chance against that team next time we play them.

It's number 2 that I feel good about. Sometimes you leave a game of footy and you KNOW that you are know where near as good as the opposition. I felt this way against the cats in 07/08. It was depressing. No team has made me feel like that this year. The team is giving us hope, that is all. It appears that if we just tinker with a couple of things and adjust a few others this team is capable of anything. That's how I feel anyway. Losing is always frustrating, losing like an insipid wet fish is infuriating - just ask a demon supporter.

[Teflon]

There is two ways you can look at a game of footy after a loss. i) We are bloody awful, insipid, and will be lucky to beat anyone the way we are playing at the moment. OR ii) We had a crack, but we weren't good enough BUT we are a chance against that team next time we play them.

Theres a 3rd way to look at a game:

iii) You arent an awful side, you are as good as the opposition and you havent had a genuine crack.

Apart from a real 12 min burst late I felt we fell into that category Friday.

Sure, we came back and kicked 6 goals late - Crows kicked 1.6 last qtr and had Walker kicked a couple of his easy shots...truth is there probably wasnt gonna be a comeback. We looked 5 goals off the pace all night........except for a 12 min burst when we looked better....cant sweep that effort under the carpet and Watters clearly wont which is good.

Its also not the first time some serial offenders have simply needed to go back, steady and kick a much needed goal.....but consistent brain fades from senior players becomes tiring.

We are also defensively bleeding way to easily - thats to be somewhat expected as wee transition from lyon to Watters style, however, if we dream of seriously challenging again that will need to be reined in drastically.

I like the fact we look dangerous going fwd and we now have some speed in the side (desperately need Saads pressure).

[Verdun66]

Means nothing in itself, but we had the 3rd highest score of the round, on a difficult ground for us. More scoring power, but out of balance with the defence. 4 goals a quarter great, but need the other mob only getting 2 or 3.

[Moods]

Theres a 3rd way to look at a game:

iii) You arent an awful side, you are as good as the opposition and you havent had a genuine crack.

Apart from a real 12 min burst late I felt we fell into that category Friday.

Come off it Teflon - just because in a 12 minute burst we happened to convert, you decided that this was the only part of the game we were having a crack?

I thought we looked insipid at the start of the game. Terrible in fact. Allowed the Crows to gain the ascendancy. Half way through the first to about 25 minutes into the third I reckon we were having a real go.

IN the last the Crows DID miss some easy shots but they weren't all gimmees. Walker hit the post twice from about 50m. That's not a gimme shot. Just because normally he's a beautiful kick doesn't make the shot a gimme. In every game where two teams are evenly matched, both teams will have their moments of ascendancy. When we had ours, many times we missed shots that not only AFL footballers should convert, but I'd expect park footballers to convert. In the last 1/4 they had their chances to seal the game - they couldn't. We had our turn and I believe we could have actually won the bloody thing. Milney running into an open goal when we had them on the ropes and then missing was a disgrace. The goals at the end were always going to be too little too late. In the end though I thought the scoreboard accurately reflected the game. The crows were slightly better and deserved to win, but our boys weren't disgraced.

When you say option 3 - it implies that you actually believe that we are a top 2 team. Because we were playing a top 2 team interstate. You say we are just as good as them, but didn't have a crack. In essence you are saying that you believe that we are probably the best team in the comp, that should have beaten the next best team on their home turf. I know you have said you have reviewed your position on the team, but changing it rom 11th best to best is a big jump.......

[HitTheBoundary]

I dont just log on to tell other posters what they can/cant say after a game

Actually, if you go back and read your posts over the weekend you'll see that that's all you did. Over and over again.

Some of us (like myself) are not in Australia and one of the main ways we follow the Saints is via this site. So when discussion is replaced by blatant over the top slagging of others without discussion of the game it is very frustrating to read.

But I do see in more recent posts with Moods that you actually discussed the game, which was a refreshing change and was what I was requesting. I assume you'd sobered up.

On a more positive note, my emails (and I assume the emails of others) to SEN have been heard, and the Part 2 of the interview is now up.

http://www.sen.com.au/audioplayer/Audio ... rt-2)/4935

[Teflon]

I dont just log on to tell other posters what they can/cant say after a game

Actually, if you go back and read your posts over the weekend you'll see that that's all you did. Over and over again.

Some of us (like myself) are not in Australia and one of the main ways we follow the Saints is via this site. So when discussion is replaced by blatant over the top slagging of others without discussion of the game it is very frustrating to read.

But I do see in more recent posts with Moods that you actually discussed the game, which was a refreshing change and was what I was requesting. I assume you'd sobered up.

On a more positive note, my emails (and I assume the emails of others) to SEN have been heard, and the Part 2 of the interview is now up.

http://www.sen.com.au/audioplayer/Audio ... rt-2)/4935

You clearly enjoy a drop or two of your own bath water......but I do like the fact you have at least started to READ my posts.

I'd like to stroke your ego and suggest my discussion with Moods was all brought about cause "you requested it" but I have to let you down and suggest you talk a bit of dribble.....I mean....you've even managed to change SEN, again on the back of "your request"..powerful man...

Id get hold of that ego if I were you.....although mum said you were always right......doesnt make it so.

My views on Friday were ALL about the game and I stand by them 100% - sure if the odd smart @ss has a crack un-football related...well then....one has the right of reply...surely that exists....even o/s?

Anyone whose been round SS longer than 5 mins knows I come here to talk footy and that I leave the cr@p to important, overseas "guests" like yourself...and regular Marto V Plugger peeing contests...

Enjoy your own bathwater!

[saintbrat]

I got email alerting to link being fixed so emails did work

[Teflon]

Theres a 3rd way to look at a game:

iii) You arent an awful side, you are as good as the opposition and you havent had a genuine crack.

Apart from a real 12 min burst late I felt we fell into that category Friday.

Come off it Teflon - just because in a 12 minute burst we happened to convert, you decided that this was the only part of the game we were having a crack?

I thought we looked insipid at the start of the game. Terrible in fact. Allowed the Crows to gain the ascendancy. Half way through the first to about 25 minutes into the third I reckon we were having a real go.

IN the last the Crows DID miss some easy shots but they weren't all gimmees. Walker hit the post twice from about 50m. That's not a gimme shot. Just because normally he's a beautiful kick doesn't make the shot a gimme. In every game where two teams are evenly matched, both teams will have their moments of ascendancy. When we had ours, many times we missed shots that not only AFL footballers should convert, but I'd expect park footballers to convert. In the last 1/4 they had their chances to seal the game - they couldn't. We had our turn and I believe we could have actually won the bloody thing. Milney running into an open goal when we had them on the ropes and then missing was a disgrace. The goals at the end were always going to be too little too late. In the end though I thought the scoreboard accurately reflected the game. The crows were slightly better and deserved to win, but our boys weren't disgraced.

When you say option 3 - it implies that you actually believe that we are a top 2 team. Because we were playing a top 2 team interstate. You say we are just as good as them, but didn't have a crack. In essence you are saying that you believe that we are probably the best team in the comp, that should have beaten the next best team on their home turf. I know you have said you have reviewed your position on the team, but changing it rom 11th best to best is a big jump.......

You've contradicted yourself 18 times and not recognised it once.

You see, the last 12 minutes wasnt purely about our inability to kick a goal it was about the WAY we dominated them (your "second best" AFL side i see..) - where was that for the 3 previous qtrs if they were having a crack as you say??? Even Watters made that friggin point AFTER the game.....is he wrong too????

In your post above you tell us it was "all too little to late"....that in itself implies we didnt fire a genuine shot till the end - you then argue we did have a go from qtr 1???????/ which is it? make up your mind.

Walkers shots were not all from 50 - rubbish.

As for the "Crows top 2" - no, I dont believe they are (ladder positions dont always indicate the best sides in such a flawed draw competition...everyone realises that..). Infact I learnt a fair bit about the Crows and I think the draw has been kind and they have improved but will struggle in melb against quality come finals. I also think we have improved since the start of the year (we had to..) so what has some earlier prediction got to do with now? I mean, Sanderson post game had no qualms in indicating we were the better side in the last...

Anyway, you thought we "had a crack" all night. I dont and Watters doesnt. Im going with the coach. Our last 12 minutes domination of the supposed top 2 team should urge you to demand more cause this side has it and accepting anything less lets them off the hook (which is why Watters was at pains NOT to praise our to-little to late "comeback").

This is refreshing....previous St Kilda sides might have been tempted to release a 12 minute "Comeback DVD"...

[Teflon]

I got email alerting to link being fixed so emails did work

Incorrect.

Only 1 email worked - the "important" one from o/s.....

But thanks for clearing that up..

[matrix]

[HitTheBoundary]

Anyone whose been round SS longer than 5 mins knows I come here to talk footy

And you want to comment on my ego?

All I was trying to do was alert others to the fact that the link was up. Just because you think everything is all about you doesn't mean we all do the same. If you'd read the thread there was a request that we all send emails - so it's quite obvious that it was a cumulative effect.

By the way, thanks to Saintbrat for all the links she provides, those of us with limited access to info appreciate it.

And as Matrix suggested this is becoming a tad tedious, so that's it from me.

Have a nice day Teflon.

[Moods]

Theres a 3rd way to look at a game:

iii) You arent an awful side, you are as good as the opposition and you havent had a genuine crack.

Apart from a real 12 min burst late I felt we fell into that category Friday.

Come off it Teflon - just because in a 12 minute burst we happened to convert, you decided that this was the only part of the game we were having a crack?

I thought we looked insipid at the start of the game. Terrible in fact. Allowed the Crows to gain the ascendancy. Half way through the first to about 25 minutes into the third I reckon we were having a real go.

IN the last the Crows DID miss some easy shots but they weren't all gimmees. Walker hit the post twice from about 50m. That's not a gimme shot. Just because normally he's a beautiful kick doesn't make the shot a gimme. In every game where two teams are evenly matched, both teams will have their moments of ascendancy. When we had ours, many times we missed shots that not only AFL footballers should convert, but I'd expect park footballers to convert. In the last 1/4 they had their chances to seal the game - they couldn't. We had our turn and I believe we could have actually won the bloody thing. Milney running into an open goal when we had them on the ropes and then missing was a disgrace. The goals at the end were always going to be too little too late. In the end though I thought the scoreboard accurately reflected the game. The crows were slightly better and deserved to win, but our boys weren't disgraced.

When you say option 3 - it implies that you actually believe that we are a top 2 team. Because we were playing a top 2 team interstate. You say we are just as good as them, but didn't have a crack. In essence you are saying that you believe that we are probably the best team in the comp, that should have beaten the next best team on their home turf. I know you have said you have reviewed your position on the team, but changing it rom 11th best to best is a big jump.......

You've contradicted yourself 18 times and not recognised it once.

You see, the last 12 minutes wasnt purely about our inability to kick a goal it was about the WAY we dominated them (your "second best" AFL side i see..) - where was that for the 3 previous qtrs if they were having a crack as you say??? Even Watters made that friggin point AFTER the game.....is he wrong too????

In your post above you tell us it was "all too little to late"....that in itself implies we didnt fire a genuine shot till the end - you then argue we did have a go from qtr 1???????/ which is it? make up your mind.

Walkers shots were not all from 50 - rubbish.

As for the "Crows top 2" - no, I dont believe they are (ladder positions dont always indicate the best sides in such a flawed draw competition...everyone realises that..). Infact I learnt a fair bit about the Crows and I think the draw has been kind and they have improved but will struggle in melb against quality come finals. I also think we have improved since the start of the year (we had to..) so what has some earlier prediction got to do with now? I mean, Sanderson post game had no qualms in indicating we were the better side in the last...

Anyway, you thought we "had a crack" all night. I dont and Watters doesnt. Im going with the coach. Our last 12 minutes domination of the supposed top 2 team should urge you to demand more cause this side has it and accepting anything less lets them off the hook (which is why Watters was at pains NOT to praise our to-little to late "comeback").

This is refreshing....previous St Kilda sides might have been tempted to release a 12 minute "Comeback DVD"...

First up - you expected us to dominate the Crows all game like we did in the last 12 minutes? That is unrealistic in my opinion. As I said every game has ebbs and flows. We definitely were in control that last 12 minutes AND we started to capitalise on it. For the most part I thought we were having a genuine crack. You can have a crack against a quality team without being 10 goals up you know? Missing easy goals is not a sign of a team NOT having a crack. You can section off any period of time in a game where a team is in control and look at the stats. The stats tell you that contested possession etc is up for that period. Means nothing. The overview is what counts. I think in the end we pretty much broke even on most the Key Indicators.

Not sure I said ALL of Walkers shots were from 50. Think I said 2 of them were. One was from right in front.

I take your point re ladder positions, but what else can we go on? We're up to Rd 12, so it's as accurate a guide as anything I reckon. Not as if we're talking Rd 5. The crows are definitely a top 4 team - as things stand right now.

Watters said all the right things after the game. I too would have said those exact same things. I'm not sure he ever questioned the player's effort though. The execution is what frustrated him (and everyone else) Where did Watters say we weren't having a crack?

Let's get one thing clear, I'm not sure anyone on here was satisfied with the players missing those shots at goals, but I think plenty of us were/are satisfied with the effort being displayed by the team. That is all we are really arguing about I reckon. You say that loss is unacceptable. When is a loss EVER acceptable? It's sport though. Someone is gonna lose. If you kick like that, most times it will be us. It's hopefully an easy thing to rectify, which is why I reckon many of us aren't getting too disheartened.

[jays]

great interview really liking watters atm

[Teflon]

First up - you expected us to dominate the Crows all game like we did in the last 12 minutes? That is unrealistic in my opinion. As I said every game has ebbs and flows. We definitely were in control that last 12 minutes AND we started to capitalise on it. For the most part I thought we were having a genuine crack. You can have a crack against a quality team without being 10 goals up you know? Missing easy goals is not a sign of a team NOT having a crack. You can section off any period of time in a game where a team is in control and look at the stats. The stats tell you that contested possession etc is up for that period. Means nothing. The overview is what counts. I think in the end we pretty much broke even on most the Key Indicators.

Not sure I said ALL of Walkers shots were from 50. Think I said 2 of them were. One was from right in front.

I take your point re ladder positions, but what else can we go on? We're up to Rd 12, so it's as accurate a guide as anything I reckon. Not as if we're talking Rd 5. The crows are definitely a top 4 team - as things stand right now.

Watters said all the right things after the game. I too would have said those exact same things. I'm not sure he ever questioned the player's effort though. The execution is what frustrated him (and everyone else) Where did Watters say we weren't having a crack?

Let's get one thing clear, I'm not sure anyone on here was satisfied with the players missing those shots at goals, but I think plenty of us were/are satisfied with the effort being displayed by the team. That is all we are really arguing about I reckon. You say that loss is unacceptable. When is a loss EVER acceptable? It's sport though. Someone is gonna lose. If you kick like that, most times it will be us. It's hopefully an easy thing to rectify, which is why I reckon many of us aren't getting too disheartened.

First up Scott Watters quote: "Im loathe to praise the comeback...the game goes for 4 quarters..."

Lets get this straight cause I think Watters was clear - you dont say the above if you think the side has had a crack for the WHOLE 4 qtrs. Clearly Watters does not believe that to be the case.

Your level of "have a crack" is less than mine and the coach.
I do not believe Crows are bona fide top 2 regardlessof ladder positions - this years enormously even, ladder positions say little.

Obviously you were just happy to get so close. That wont ever get us a flag and weve "so close" before..........its not enough. In 12 minutes we showed what we could do. I realise no side dominates for 4 qtrs but i expect longer periods than 12 mins over 4 qtrs.