Saintsational Fan Forum - A passionate community of St Kilda Football Club fans discussing news, history, players, trade rumours, results, AFL stats and more.
BigMart wrote:Why.... Do you think it's never happened??
It is fair and just criticism of a paid footballer..... Do they escape critique....
Did not pull out tonight, just not hard enough at it on the HBF and in the FP when it was his turn....... I think he has been 'gifted games' as you call it, without actually demonstrating a good performance in prac games, at sandy or at STK......has he played a good game whilst at stk since he arrived?.....ie/ more than 20 touches... Not from my memory
As I said, he must train well.....
Which attribute or performance stands out???
He did hesitate, pull out, dog it..or..however you want to describe it last year twice, right in front of me, can be a confidence thing..... Like with Fiora, or just not a natural instinct to put your face over the pill.....
Sorry but again I say no AFL player dogs it and IMO is a terrible thing to say about any player. He doesnt go in as hard as some but he is new to the game and still learning and growing. I would be waiting a bit longer to put that tag on any player from any side. I have a feeling you had it in for him from the start because you couldnt find his photo and that has upset you. Anyway you make your judgements on 8 games and I will wait. I have a feeling that people who make calls early like dogging it maybe gogs themselves. Woof Woof.
I have a feeling that people that defend players that have a reputation of dogging contests have indeed themselves been accused of doing so themselves hence their rabid defence of such players due to their non acceptance of their own hard ball short comings
Cripps is young and he has time to readjust his attitude about attacking the footy in a 50/50 one on one contest especially when the ball is between him and an oncoming player
BUT
At the moment he has been seen to squib hard ball one on one contests and go out of his way to avoid hard body contact
Sorry Plug but you are wrong on this one - let's hope James in time can prove Mart and myself wrong
Shows nativity, that comment..... P66 not sure if you've been a footballer, but harness at the ball and courage are one of the only things that don't require age.
I have seen Geary, Armitage, R.Clarke, Steven, mQualter, ledger, Lynch, Toss, Hayes all in their debut years and from DAY 1 the only are out of question was the fact that when it was their turn..... There was NO other option/alternative but to fight for the ball 100% with whatever kilo power they had
Luke Ball, Matt Maguire, steven Baker, Max Hudghton extreme courage at 18/19
It has little to do with age, and more to do with instinct...... The old fight or flight
Players don't stop and think about how many pre seasons they've done, how big the opponent is....they focus on putting what they have on the line.... To win the ball
I am most certainly qusstioning his hardness, like I did with josh Houlihan, Phil Raymond.... And there have been others who just weren't fierce enough at the contest....Fiora was constantly criticized for this, Gram is......
Of course there are varying degrees.... Lenny at the top....
Unfortunately from what we've seen, cripps needs to be tougher at the contest, for him it will be more confronting when his peers and coaches say it, which they will.... than a supporter thinking it
BTW
If you are taken by the 'sub goals' you need to understand how that came about.... Would have been interesting if the ball was turned over
Shows nativity, that comment..... P66 not sure if you've been a footballer, but harness at the ball and courage are one of the only things that don't require age.
I have seen Geary, Armitage, R.Clarke, Steven, mQualter, ledger, Lynch, Toss, Hayes all in their debut years and from DAY 1 the only are out of question was the fact that when it was their turn..... There was NO other option/alternative but to fight for the ball 100% with whatever kilo power they had
Luke Ball, Matt Maguire, steven Baker, Max Hudghton extreme courage at 18/19
It has little to do with age, and more to do with instinct...... The old fight or flight
Players don't stop and think about how many pre seasons they've done, how big the opponent is....they focus on putting what they have on the line.... To win the ball
I am most certainly qusstioning his hardness, like I did with josh Houlihan, Phil Raymond.... And there have been others who just weren't fierce enough at the contest....Fiora was constantly criticized for this, Gram is......
Of course there are varying degrees.... Lenny at the top....
Unfortunately from what we've seen, cripps needs to be tougher at the contest, for him it will be more confronting when his peers and coaches say it, which they will.... than a supporter thinking it
BTW
If you are taken by the 'sub goals' you need to understand how that came about.... Would have been interesting if the ball was turned over
Interesting points Marto. You point out his deficiencies well, but not his attributes, which are mainly centred around his pace with ball in hand.
I thought he looked good playing on a half back flank in the NAB game against the Swans. Obviously can't be risked there in the full side, but I'd like to see him play there at Sandy a while.
Hird... The unflushable one is now... just a turd...
And cripps and Geary seemed to be earmarked as running small defenders.....
He has been overlooked for Polo simply because his defensive game doesn't stand up at this stage....
If his only attribute is pace, seriously a footballer needs one more thing than than that...... Ability, which combines skill, courage and game sense.....brad Howard was quick, so was alisair smith..
Spinner, come on??
He's played more than 8 games of footy since he arrived
What do you think of his game??
Frankly I haven't got much of a clue what his other attributes are because he doesn't get enough of the footy to be able to judge... though he looks to be a reasonable user of the ball... and he knows where the big sticks are...
Hird... The unflushable one is now... just a turd...
Generally five meters in front of him, because he's run fwd of the ball and got a cheapie..... and his kicking is questionable
I know I'm being hard on the lad, but really.....as I said before, besides the 'joe the goose' goals..... He has sowed nothing to me that suggests he even any good, at sandy or stk.....
And is GETTING a GAME ahead of 20 others.....and he has a big flaw in his game
BigMart wrote:Generally five meters in front of him, because he's run fwd of the ball and got a cheapie..... and his kicking is questionable
I know I'm being hard on the lad, but really.....as I said before, besides the 'joe the goose' goals..... He has sowed nothing to me that suggests he even any good, at sandy or stk.....
And is GETTING a GAME ahead of 20 others.....and he has a big flaw in his game
So why is he getting a game great one. That is 2 coaches who think he goes ok. It may shock you but you could be wrong. Or as you would think that is now 2 coaches who know less than BM.
McQualter, Eddy, McGough even Jones all hard nuts and super quick and brilliant users of the ball........... He's not an inside mid, give him a go, he gave us some run whe we needed it most. I'd rather him than the aforementioned with all of 5 quarrers of football under his belt.
So the selectors and coaches have got it right every game this year??
Hindsight is a wonderful thing for supporters, it answers questions...
I think we made a huge error against port at the selection table....Maybe there was a reason, hopefully
Last night we were out coached..... Ross did what he does best
But that's you're party line.....as usual, here's a thought
Give your opinion, not the coaches..... For all you know, the coaches tore shreds of him.....
BigMart wrote:So the selectors and coaches have got it right every game this year??
Hindsight is a wonderful thing for supporters, it answers questions...
I think we made a huge error against port at the selection table....Maybe there was a reason, hopefully
Last night we were out coached..... Ross did what he does best
But that's you're party line.....as usual, here's a thought
Give your opinion, not the coaches..... For all you know, the coaches tore shreds of him.....
I actually would have dropped him before this game. That is my opinion. Why when i say someone you then ask a question that has nothing to do with what I actually said. read what i say not what you imagine. Who said selectors have got it right all year? i said 2 coaches have rated cripps so maybe you are wrong. do you understand wrong because i am sure you would never have said that word in conjunction with something you have thought.
You clearly argued the point about Cripps and validated it by saying two coaches disagree so therefore I must be wrong..... I simply rebutted and said coaches are obviously not always right...
And because that is you're usual stance, I offered the advice, to come up with you're own opinion.....and when you did you, which agreed with mine
He should not be in the team
It took some time, but thanks....
And why would I think all my opinions are wrong, why why I give them firstly, and why would I argue the point....seriously. Until proven wrong, why would I believe my opinion to be incorrect.... The coaches did not prove this...
Have done in the past
Last night, my opinion was Dempster was no match for Pav....he proved me wrong
BigMart wrote:You clearly argued the point about Cripps and validated it by saying two coaches disagree so therefore I must be wrong..... I simply rebutted and said coaches are obviously not always right...
And because that is you're usual stance, I offered the advice, to come up with you're own opinion.....and when you did you, which agreed with mine
He should not be in the team
It took some time, but thanks....
And why would I think all my opinions are wrong, why why I give them firstly, and why would I argue the point....seriously. Until proven wrong, why would I believe my opinion to be incorrect.... The coaches did not prove this...
Have done in the past
Last night, my opinion was Dempster was no match for Pav....he proved me wrong
Again you just dont get it. This started because said he dogs it. It has nothing to do with the players ability. If you had of said I think cripps should be dropped i would have agreed. You say he is well off the mark as a player. I dont say that. I just said I would have dropped him this week. I certainly arent agreeing with you. And i still say 2 coaches have played him in most games he has been available so I reckon they think he can play and I also reckon they have more footy knowledge that even you, the great footy god.
BigMart wrote:I think that was the plan for him....initially
And cripps and Geary seemed to be earmarked as running small defenders.....
He has been overlooked for Polo simply because his defensive game doesn't stand up at this stage....
If his only attribute is pace, seriously a footballer needs one more thing than than that...... Ability, which combines skill, courage and game sense.....brad Howard was quick, so was alisair smith..
Spinner, come on??
He's played more than 8 games of footy since he arrived
What do you think of his game??
I think he is a good kick... Not sure how you don't rate his kicking
I think he is composed with the ball... Especially when stepping up to AFL level
He's got great skills. Havent seen him dog it yet unlike you. Regardless, one act doesn't make him.
19 yrs 11 m....who missed most of his first year injured.
Still very much wet behind the ears. Plenty of talent, and plenty of room for improvement.
It will be hard for him to develop though if he gets locked into being a sub though. Needs full games either at Sandy or in the seniors.
We have quite a few promising young players and so I would like to see most of them rotating through the seniors.
We need to develop players this year. Some will prosper and some not. Way too early to make a call one way or the other on any of the newbies including Cripps.
He has the tools to make it But certainly needs to learn to impose himself on the play more.
Last edited by saintsRrising on Sat 21 Apr 2012 7:57pm, edited 1 time in total.
Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
Look, As I said, I seriously hope he turns out a player....
But instinctive signs are not good, and the only testament to his good skill was in his draft bio, live of on Telly he lookes rushed and lacks polish with the footy...
He definitely does not bore in....
It's funny, we can make judgements about draft kids at 17yo, sometimes after a few outings or two or three rep games, but a 19yo who has been on our list for 18 months played AFL, NAB, VFL and intra club we reserve judgement....unless of course it's positive....
Siposs was allowed plaudits after 1 or 2 games, Milera the same, Stanley, Steven..... Etc...why....because it is normally evident very quickly whether a kids got something..... Even more evident if the are missing something
I would most definitely persevere with our investment, and put time into him, because he obviously has talent..... But so did Raymond and Houlihan, loads.....but as far as getting a senior game goes...
The odd game as a sub for now, and plenty of time at Sandy developing against mature bodies.....
Like to see Ledger and Ross and Newnes and Winmar matured the same
Siposs, not so much..... He needs to be fast tracked. He has something we can use right now. Ability.
He looked a bit lost out there and didn't quite get the pace of the game. Still kicked a nice goal, however blue an easy one and should have never called for the handball from Kosi (Kosi's fault as well).
I still think he will end up an ok player however at this point I think he needs a few games with Sandy. Time to give Siposs, Ledger or Ross a go.
Cripps has had a lot of opportunity in the senior side ... far more than Ledger, Winmar, Siposs or Seb Ross ... and IMO has done no more than any of them to warrant selection.
I reckon it's time for him to go back and show some VFL form and give a couple of the other guys a go.
BigMart wrote:Kidding yeah, he was the freshest man on the ground..... Used his run to get on the end of the play.... Got two uncontested possessions in front pf goal and lost 3 one on one contests around the ground...
Young Newnes looked a bit off the pace, but at least competed.... I think he has a future.....
Newnes was elbowed so hard in the ribs by the Dockers player he was standing that he couldn't stand up straight and the umpires let him do it multiple times while just watching. As for Cripps he got absolutely smashed at one point after trying to contest the ball. Kids are going to be softer and take time. We need these guys to take massive strides and should be given banks of 5 games or so to show faith and develop a sense of belonging.
you deserve to be belted big mart. anyone who calls a 19 year old "soft" has NFI.
u clearly watched him have one bad game at sandy last year and cant move on from it. u need to move on. cripps should belt you one.
Leigh Matthews reckons the biggest coaching mistake he made was when he arrived at the lions he thought nigel lappin was "soft" - he now says he could not have been more wrong.
Getting knocked off the ball, because you're not strong enough and not actually going for the ball to avoid contact are two different things..... He is 19. So what!
I will tell you one thing, I have seen Seb Ross play two games, he is 18, Ledger play about 8 games he is 19. Arryn play 10 or so senior games he is 18......I would bet, if they were in the way of Jon Brown, none would flich.....Armitage and Geary would have gone harder at 18.....browny would smash all of them, they would accept it, and hopefully get up....it's called taking your turn....
If Crippa doesn't want fans to question his hardness, instead of belting me, here's a f***ing idea..... Toughen up on the ground, hit contests like you want to win the ball at any cost and his reputation won't be questioned....
Not calling him weak..... He must have some courage, to have gotten there..... But to now make the grade, he needs to take that up a notch....to the point where it is not even a consideration...
Joey had to do it, Dal to a lesser extent.....it did not come naturally to them....
Lenny is the benchmark I know but,
There is footage of Lenny first game....and he was faced with the scary reality of meeting Archer at full tilt head on, he never deviated, got dropped and got straight back up..... It was pretty evident from the start, he was as gutsy as they come....and he was 19....
Not a problem with him at all, and I hope he plays 200 games and wins a B&F. Just want to see him do what is expected of every professional..... His job
And a part of his role description is....whenever you have to take you turn and put yourself in harms way for your club and team mates....it happens, non negotiable...... need to accept that as a paid footballer
Or don't put your hand out every month and accept your cheque..
Just as players deserve time to sort out skill deficiencies, or any other issues as young men.... He too should be afforded time to do that. But IMO should not be getting a senior gig on what I have seen so far.
I would not give up on him, nor would I delist him at seasons end......4 years before accurate assessment can be made on that front. But not scared of saying, he needs to be tougher at the ball than he currently is...
