If he wasnt what about another 10 or so players.degruch wrote:He wasn't on our side.plugger66 wrote:Plenty of Dons players. What about our side.degruch wrote:Essendon, or St Kilda?plugger66 wrote:Who was better than him today? Give us some names.Teflon wrote:Can not even remotely agree.skeptic wrote:Gram was ok today
The turn overs were critical - deplorable and the poor defensive body on body work when 1 out was comical.
30 touches dont tell the story.
Jason Gram B.O.G
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- mad saint guy
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33 touches and 0 tackles says a lot. He is good at hanging off a pack to get a cheap kick which he hacks forward, but that is the extent of his contribution at the moment. He is well ahead of Jones, Gamble, Peake and Dempster but he has some serious flaws in his game. I reckon he got a massive spray from Ross at some point tonight because after three quarter time he did attack the footy with some level of intensity and put his body on the line when he got hurt making that spoil.
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+1plugger66 wrote:I dont get what people want out of this guy. He kicked a goal tonight from the wing and set up at least 5 shots for goal for other players. He was in the top 6 players for us for sure. Yes some of his kicking was ordinary but some was also very good. Way ahead of many tonight.st_Trav_ofWA wrote:plugger not doubting BJ Gilbert and Gwilt had shockers .... but those guys will make up for their bad games (and if not them its to the VFL for them ) Gram has been progresively going down hill ever since the whole Lovett thing ... he got pleanty of touches today but he did nothing with those touches plus as a defender he does not play on his man well enough to convince me that he adds value to the team ...plugger66 wrote:What a crap thread. Gram was better than most but hey he is letting us down. Must be a good player if we think he is the problem. Looks like he is worth 10 goals. maybe we better look at Joey, Bj, Gilbert and Gwilt before hom tonight.
enough is enough there are blokes like Mini and Eddy who get dropped and delisted because thier form go's down hill yet Gram keeps his spot .... the bloke can play he has shown it but for whatever reason he just doesnt deliver anymore
Looks like his comments last week were spot on as well.
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players like Gram will always hold us back
cannot kick properly, turns it over
a show pony who does not know what a hard ball is
a downhill skier if ever there was one
try to trade him at the end of the year if anyone else is stupid enough to take him
it's the only way we will get any more value out of him
cannot kick properly, turns it over
a show pony who does not know what a hard ball is
a downhill skier if ever there was one
try to trade him at the end of the year if anyone else is stupid enough to take him
it's the only way we will get any more value out of him
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The spoil and the goal were the only useful things I spotted from him tonight. I noted, when he booted his 50m goal, he wasn't out of puff at all...and it didn't surprise me. Maybe I'm being harsh on him, but all I saw were cheap possessions and crucial turnovers.mad saint guy wrote:33 touches and 0 tackles says a lot. He is good at hanging off a pack to get a cheap kick which he hacks forward, but that is the extent of his contribution at the moment. He is well ahead of Jones, Gamble, Peake and Dempster but he has some serious flaws in his game. I reckon he got a massive spray from Ross at some point tonight because after three quarter time he did attack the footy with some level of intensity and put his body on the line when he got hurt making that spoil.
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+1degruch wrote:There should be a mirror on his locker this week.maverick wrote:Looks like his comments last week were spot on as well.
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Jesus Cripes ! why pick on the guy that got the most possessions of anyone in the team???
He certainly has some glaring weaknesses in his game, but he's also way up there and one of our most successful in other departments.
He did not lose us this game today.
3/4 of the team are ahead of him for blameworthiness.
He certainly has some glaring weaknesses in his game, but he's also way up there and one of our most successful in other departments.
He did not lose us this game today.
3/4 of the team are ahead of him for blameworthiness.
Yep 30 touches but hes also the worst kick in the side if you want a 25m chip kick. Launches it 40m in the air and invariably misses the target
Must also get that stupid toepoke out of his game. Put your head over the footy and pick it up Grammy, you'll draw a free if you get hit and thats footy sometimes
Must also get that stupid toepoke out of his game. Put your head over the footy and pick it up Grammy, you'll draw a free if you get hit and thats footy sometimes
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posted this in another thread.
fair dinkum, i just threw up a little bit in my mouth. grams performances over the last couple of months have been pathetic. last night he was no where when the game was there to be won. his turn overs and lack of effort killed us when it mattered. the guy is a massive liability and is part of the group that is eating at the culture of our club.
his lack of effort cost gifted essendon 2-3 goals in the first half.
delist or trade. tell the pisshead to GTFO.
i just cant believe people are falling for his 2nd half performance once the game was over.
fair dinkum, i just threw up a little bit in my mouth. grams performances over the last couple of months have been pathetic. last night he was no where when the game was there to be won. his turn overs and lack of effort killed us when it mattered. the guy is a massive liability and is part of the group that is eating at the culture of our club.
his lack of effort cost gifted essendon 2-3 goals in the first half.
delist or trade. tell the pisshead to GTFO.
i just cant believe people are falling for his 2nd half performance once the game was over.
Excellent post.defacto wrote:posted this in another thread.
fair dinkum, i just threw up a little bit in my mouth. grams performances over the last couple of months have been pathetic. last night he was no where when the game was there to be won. his turn overs and lack of effort killed us when it mattered. the guy is a massive liability and is part of the group that is eating at the culture of our club.
his lack of effort cost gifted essendon 2-3 goals in the first half.
delist or trade. tell the pisshead to GTFO.
i just cant believe people are falling for his 2nd half performance once the game was over.
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21 kicks
12 handballs
9 marks
1 goal
8 contested possessions
26 uncontested possessions
(dont know how that works when you have 33 touches, but anyway we roughly get the picture)
67% effective disposal percentage
7 clangers
no contested marks
1 mark inside 50
3 centre clearances
6 inside 50s (equal most along with smith)
5 rebound 50s
earnt 1 free, gave away 2
0 tackles (only player along with the sub peake)
3 one %ers (dawson had 11 and dempster had 10)
1 goal assist
so really if he didnt shank all those kicks, the turnovers/clangers wouldve been way down and his effective disposal percentage would have gone way up and we'd be saying he had a decent game (ok no tackles is a worry).
so its the kicking
is he at too much of a wide stride as he goes to kick?
is he looking at the tatt on his arm when he drops the footy, because he obviously isnt looking down at his slipper??
its certainly frustrating![Confused :?](./images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
12 handballs
9 marks
1 goal
8 contested possessions
26 uncontested possessions
(dont know how that works when you have 33 touches, but anyway we roughly get the picture)
67% effective disposal percentage
7 clangers
no contested marks
1 mark inside 50
3 centre clearances
6 inside 50s (equal most along with smith)
5 rebound 50s
earnt 1 free, gave away 2
0 tackles (only player along with the sub peake)
3 one %ers (dawson had 11 and dempster had 10)
1 goal assist
so really if he didnt shank all those kicks, the turnovers/clangers wouldve been way down and his effective disposal percentage would have gone way up and we'd be saying he had a decent game (ok no tackles is a worry).
so its the kicking
is he at too much of a wide stride as he goes to kick?
is he looking at the tatt on his arm when he drops the footy, because he obviously isnt looking down at his slipper??
its certainly frustrating
![Confused :?](./images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
can we get a break down of the stats by qtr. my bet is the first 2 qtrs were woefullmatrix wrote:21 kicks
12 handballs
9 marks
1 goal
8 contested possessions
26 uncontested possessions
(dont know how that works when you have 33 touches, but anyway we roughly get the picture)
67% effective disposal percentage
7 clangers
no contested marks
1 mark inside 50
3 centre clearances
6 inside 50s (equal most along with smith)
5 rebound 50s
earnt 1 free, gave away 2
0 tackles (only player along with the sub peake)
3 one %ers (dawson had 11 and dempster had 10)
1 goal assist
so really if he didnt shank all those kicks, the turnovers/clangers wouldve been way down and his effective disposal percentage would have gone way up and we'd be saying he had a decent game (ok no tackles is a worry).
so its the kicking
is he at too much of a wide stride as he goes to kick?
is he looking at the tatt on his arm when he drops the footy, because he obviously isnt looking down at his slipper??
its certainly frustrating
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Dawson - Weak/Lazy.
Clarke - Lazy/Stupid Mistakes.
Dempster - Lyons love child - Weak/Lazy/Idiot.
Gram - Costly/Makes stupid decisons/Try hard.
Ross Lyon - Make Changes FFS. Other coaches and teams know our game style/plays.
Options: Tank the rest of the season.
Saints not competitive 2011. Move onwards to 2012.
Clarke - Lazy/Stupid Mistakes.
Dempster - Lyons love child - Weak/Lazy/Idiot.
Gram - Costly/Makes stupid decisons/Try hard.
Ross Lyon - Make Changes FFS. Other coaches and teams know our game style/plays.
Options: Tank the rest of the season.
Saints not competitive 2011. Move onwards to 2012.
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18 touches in a half is great, but if they're either ineffectual or outright turnovers it's of no benefit to the team. I've got no problems with Gram's ability to find the footy. I can even live with the occasional squibbed contest and missed tackle if he's getting 25-30 quality touches a week.BigMart wrote:He had 18 at half time....on mmm he was given our best with dal at ht
However, when you factor in the poor disposals those 25-30 touches get discounted to about 15 worthwhile disposals. At that rate, he's nowhere near as valuable and his negatives start to outweigh his positives.
For Gram to remain in the team, he simply has to use the ball better.
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What possible use is tanking the rest of the season?? GWS get all the early picks this time. All tanking will do this year is cause a hell of a lot more angst for both the club and us supporters.Ajantis wrote:Dawson - Weak/Lazy.
Clarke - Lazy/Stupid Mistakes.
Dempster - Lyons love child - Weak/Lazy/Idiot.
Gram - Costly/Makes stupid decisons/Try hard.
Ross Lyon - Make Changes FFS. Other coaches and teams know our game style/plays.
Options: Tank the rest of the season.
Saints not competitive 2011. Move onwards to 2012.
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AgreeStatsman wrote:18 touches in a half is great, but if they're either ineffectual or outright turnovers it's of no benefit to the team. I've got no problems with Gram's ability to find the footy. I can even live with the occasional squibbed contest and missed tackle if he's getting 25-30 quality touches a week.BigMart wrote:He had 18 at half time....on mmm he was given our best with dal at ht
However, when you factor in the poor disposals those 25-30 touches get discounted to about 15 worthwhile disposals. At that rate, he's nowhere near as valuable and his negatives start to outweigh his positives.
For Gram to remain in the team, he simply has to use the ball better.
It would more beneficial in the long term to try some kids with pace and skill in the waste of space Gram occupies
only way the team can improve
Gram is a total liability
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